I have run accross a descrepence between Ivid the undying and the other 2nd. ed. AD&D material.
I believe the Ashes, Markland, and Iuz the evil all place Tanar'ri within the Geart Kingdom and forget to mention Baatezu placement..
While the soruce book Ivid the Undying places Baatezu as the most comman fiend in the Great Kingdom.
I feel the balance between the major evils should be clarified.
My thoughts tend to see lands of Iuz as chaotic evil (Tanar'ri),Great Kingdom lawful evil(Baatezu), and the Scarlet Brotherhood as neturel evil(Yogaloths)(sp).
There may always be pockects of conficting outer-planetery alignments within evil kingdoms, but they should be small and/or time limited.
Shifts of kingiom alignments should occuar only with a good understanding of why, how, and what the impact on Grehawk as a whole will be.
I have never been one to favor the conversion of names from the 1 st. ed. to the 2 nd. ed. in the first place.
GK had nobles making pacts with Tanar'ri and Baatezu, the main focus of the Tanar'ri was the western lands (post war) almor, so being nearer to Iuz and Nyrond ofcourse the Tanar'ri presence would concern them more than the larger Baatezu presence farther east around Rauxes.
As for your alignment theory, most evil nations or power groups tend too choose either Tanar'ri, Baatezu or Yugloths not neccessarily because of alignment but the the outer planary beings tend too demand exclusive pacts too deny resources too the others, in short a decision has too be made.
Side note: IMO the SB alignment would be (LE) given their strict structure and reliance on order, their methods without doubt are evil but since the war it is obvious they have a well developed plan to achieve their goals.
Not so Fast....Its hard for me accept an unrestriced presence of tanar'ri in the Western Lands or Great Kingdom. The Blood War runs to deep. The Baatezu lords and other lawful/neturel Powers would not risk loseing a foothold of Greyhawk to Chaotic evil.
Most NPC in the Great Kingdom are some type of lawful or neutrel and would not enter pacts with the tanar'ri unless there was no other choice. I feel that since there is such long history of Lawfullness the idea of using a Tanar'ri would repulse them. I can only image the propaganda the overking used to contol disorder and chaos.To go into an exclusive pact with a Tanar'ri within the Great Kingdom a person would risk isolating themselves from allies and being singled out.
I find only one example post war information of were the tanar'ri are specificly named within the Great Kingdom. That would be Duke Szeffrin ruler of Blood crystal and OnyxGate. This individual has a pact with Pazrael who has provided him with 30 Nabasu and some lesser tanar'ri. The Duke is full of revenge to slay Ivid and cares little of the price he will end up paying if he fails.
I find an intresting adventure with a active artifact opening a Gate to the Abyss within OnyxGate.An intervention from Hextor, Neurell, Pholtus, Heironeous, Rao and/or any Baatezu Lord could/should be developed.
I see this as a isolated plot in where a Tanar'ri lord is risking little but could potentialy reap a Kingdom.
A few other group/individual capable of being involved with a Tanar'ri would be as follows
Let me clear away any confusion, GK is definitely more involved with the Baatezu, they have an understanding with the state, the choice was made by Ivid I too gain the throne so any Tanar'ri pacts will be individual limited pacts.
Rel Astra : Fiend Sage
Spiral (Darmen) : Rexifer
Ahlissa : Reydrich (compulsion, no pact)
Cranden : Prince Ferrenan of Blacksplinter
Almor : Duke Szeffrin has a pact with Pazrael
Granted the five cases above pale in comparison to the involvement and power exercised by the Baatezu within the GK but it does show the Tannar'ri do show some interest in the GK which the Baatezu work to squash or ruin.
Remember for both the Baatezu and Tannar'ri have to be "invited" into pacts and in the case of the Great Kingdom, Ivid I opened the door wide for the Baatezu.
I don't think that either the archdevils or the demon princes / lords have fixed regions of influence in the Great Kingom. In contrast to other regions, IMC, the Great Kingdom of Aerdy is an actively contested zone in the Invisible War. This is likely because of the relatively dense human populace in the region.
Thinking in time in addition to the place, the potential thralls and servants who live in the former Great Kingdom unfortunately uncover a wealth of disparate traditions. Demogorgon once held sway on the easternmost coast of Aerdy. In the days before Sol crossed the Teesar, the Ur-Flan propitiated the Sibilant Beast. So too, one may read tales of the Demon Prince of the Undead struggling to unseat the Queen of the Marvelous Nightingale.
And while these tales are rare, it is even more difficult to recover the damned texts that extoll the role of Mephistopheles in what became Rhizia. Kotschie the Mangled Yet Mighty is spoken of often, but who knows of the machinations of the Blue Devil?
Looking into Greyhawks future I am not so concerned about the potential power increase in chaotic evil in the Great Kindom, as long as the Cook of Rao is used to weaken the forces of Iuz (cy 586?).
GreyHawk would not survive if there were that many active Tanar'ri and open gates to the Abyss around. Especially with the not so distant future of Nyondy looking grim (CE) in cy 594.
The Baatezu will continue to deal with what ever is left of Ivid and his people, licking their wounds from the Blood moon festival defeat in the former Horned Lands. Trying to build a bases for others to be invited.
I do like the idea of the Great Kindom being an open testing ground for all differnet types of influences. An oppertunity for shifting neturality,which always creates fun game play.
Thanks for the responces they have created a better understanding of my topic.
To add a little more to the mix, I worked out a few answers to confusions regarding who was doing what to who both in the Great Kingdom and elsewhere. The devils are notorious for using illusions and one of their tactics in GK was to disguise themselves as other types of fiends, spreading disinformation and confusion among observers.
I wrote on it in this article as well as a few other Hell based articles here on CF:
Does this help?
Yes and thanks O-D.
I like the descriptions of major and minor players and other locations of storyline development.
Intresting concept with the illusions of deception and decite.
I found helpful information about the Horned Society on Pied Piper Publishing 1-22-04 message board. Some of it may mimic the same information written in a past Dragon Mag ?
One day I'll review my Dragon resorces to confirm.
I also should review the Dukes of Hell secetion in the Fiend Fioilo and introduce further baddies.
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