Ok, good people, give me a point in Research. Found the following information in the 2nd Edition DMG :
page 134 (Coins section at the very top): "Coins (regardless of metal) normally weigh in at 50 to the pound."
ISSUE SOLVED. <whew!>
Again, I don't agree with the parenthetical statement (scientifically, it just doesn't add up, literally, given their unique properties), but I kinda like the idea that FIFTY coins, instead of TEN, equate to a single pound. This allows for more coins to be stuffed into a bag or chest (or basket, pouch, rare pocket, etc.), and makes more overall sense.
Thanks for bearing with me and this thread. I appreciate everybody's input and the collective knowledge we bring to any query.
The weight is not an issue at all in the 2E statement. Assuming that the weights of the different types of coins are the same is no issue at all, but it does mean that if the weights are the same then the sizes of the different types of coins are different (simply due to the difference in mass of the metal types). The coins made of heavier/more valuable metals will be smaller, and so take up less volume in a container. "How Many Coins in a Coffer?" does make the point of recommending fudging things for simplicity's sake...after explaining a whole lot about things. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
Last edited by Cebrion on Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
. . . but it does mean that if the weights are the same then the sizes of the different types of coins are different (simply due to the difference in mass of the metal types). The coins made of heavier/more valuable metals will be smaller . . .
Cebrion has the right of it. The American "old west" Silver Dollar has always been larger than the "Twenty Dollar gold piece." And pictures that I've seen show ancient "Silver Pennies" as smaller than "Copper Pieces." _________________ Mystic's web page: http://melkot.com/mysticscholar/index.html
Mystic's blog page: http://mysticscholar.blogspot.com/
In the end it is all about the weight, so that is the most important thing. On a side note, "How Many Coins in a Coffer?" does figure out how many coins actually fit in certain volumes, and the numbers are many times that of those listed in the PHB 2E chart. For example:
"We now have the following data for a standard, typical coin regardless of metallic composition — in the AD&D game:
Weight: 0.1 lb. = 1.6 ounces = 45.36 grams
Diameter: 1˝” = 3.81 cm
Thickness: 0.1” = 0.254 cm = 2.54 mm"
That is, incidentally, the size of a US "silver" dollar, but about twice as thick and twice the weight. So, a pretty hefty coin, and that is the "universal" coin size used in measuring things in the article. So...
"How many coins will fit into a chest 18”" x 30"” x 18"”? This one’'s a little easier- 12 x 20 = 240 stacks 18” high with no room left over. (If the dimensions are up to you, make the horizontal measurements multiples of 1˝" to avoid the “coffer problem“). The volume is 9720 cubic inches. Right away we see that the chest will hold 43,200 stacked coins or 38,880 loose coins. (Each stack has 180 coins; 180 x 240 = 43,200.)"
Compare that to a PHB 2E large chest measuring 36" x 24" x 24", which has a total volume of 20,736 cubic inches, which is more than twice the available volume of the above chest, but which is said to hold 5,000 coins, or less than 1/8 th the amount of the first chest. Yes, people might want to tweak the PHB 2E capacity numbers just a wee bit, but also note that at even 50 coins per pound, that chest holding roughly 66,000 stacked coins is going to weigh in at 1,320 pounds. Now, if the coins are loose then they take up about 10% more space, so there will "only" be 60,000 coins weighing 1,250 pounds in the chest then.
I just wouldn't worry about this too much, as there are more important (and entertaining) in-game things to spend time on instead. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
Hee hee. No doubt a Leomund's Secret Chest would be a back saver too. And did somebody look up how much a chest can hold for that comic? Must have. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
Not to create waves (and I actually agree with earlier findings), while I was researching something else, I came across to "pearls" pertaining to this discussion. Since we have tendancy to define by addition on other things, this would give DMs that option as well in lieu of "standardization."
In OD&D Basic book
OD&D Page 9 wrote:
a backpack or sack will hold 300 gp and weighs 30 pounds
(hence the 10/1 ratio supporting documentation).
What is interesting is on page 34 of the same book,
OD&D Page 34 wrote:
All Coins are roughly equal size and wieght, being aproximately the circumference and thickness of a quarter and weighing about twice as much as a quarter
So Using those values with what we have collected above, (5.7g per quarter)x2 that makes each "realm coin" weigh in at 11.4g, and with some 4th grade math using 453.6g per lb, we get just under 40 coins per pound. Humm certainly not 10/1
Here comes the fun part.
Taking a page 9 to page 34 comparison
300gp should have weighed 3420g or 7.54 lbs.
OR
If the weight were true (30lbs) and we hold the twice as thick quarter as a constant (11.4g)
That would be 30lbs x 453.6g per lb =13,608g / 11.4g (per coin weight)=1194 coins.
So even then they struggled with weight ratios.
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:
certainly not 10/1
