Signup
Welcome to... Canonfire! World of GreyhawK
Features
Postcards from the Flanaess
Adventures
in Greyhawk
Cities of
Oerth
Deadly
Denizens
Jason Zavoda Presents
The Gord Novels
Greyhawk Wiki
#greytalk
JOIN THE CHAT
ON DISCORD
    Canonfire :: View topic - Info on Celestian
    Canonfire Forum Index -> World of Greyhawk Discussion
    Info on Celestian
    Author Message
    Novice

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005
    Posts: 4
    From: Dreamspace

    Send private message
    Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:54 am  
    Info on Celestian

    Hello all,

    Does anyone know where (or if) I can find more detailed deity info than that provided in the LG Deities download? My character is a cleric of Celestian, and it would be nice to know something about her god besides the bare stats.

    Also, is there any information on the church of Celestian? What sort of vestments do they wear, how do they refer to themselves (Sister/Brother? etc.), do they have any holidays, are there any non-obvious taboos, is there a central hierarchy or any hierarchy at all? All that sort of thing.

    Yes, I am slightly obsessive...

    (cross-posted to WotC Living Greyhawk board)
    CF Admin

    Joined: Oct 14, 2003
    Posts: 586
    From: Rel Astra

    Send private message
    Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:33 pm  

    I don't know much about Celestian myself, but ColdPenguin submitted an article for the last postfest that may hold interest for you.

    The Celestial Archway
    _________________
    Kneel before me, or you shall be KNELT!
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Fri Jan 21, 2005 9:21 pm  

    I've got info on Celestian's priesthood somewhere, but I need to find it.

    <EDIT>

    I found some of it, but I am recalling more than I found. I have used this information for so long that I cannot even remember where I got it from or if I have personally embellished it at all. To be on the safe side, I will assume that somebody other than me came up with this information. Somebody else at CF might see this, have their memory jogged, and remember the source, if any. Here is what I recall from memory:

    There are seven ranks among the priest of Celestian. Each rank (these ranks correspond to powers gained by specialty priests of Celestian as per the 88' Greyhawk Adventures book, which is based upon the 83' boxed set entry for Celestian) is denoted by a color, and often by similar colored gemstones inset upon the priests' holy symbols. The priest levels and corresponding gemstones/colors are as follows:

    Rank & gemstone/color.....................Raiment Color
    1st-2nd: ruby(red)..............................................light blue
    3rd-4th: jacinth(fiery orange)..............................light gray
    5th-6th: topaz(golden yellow)..............................violet
    7th-8th: emerald(green)......................................blue-gray
    9th-10th: sapphire(blue)......................................dark blue
    11th-15th: amethyst(purple)................................deep purple
    16th+: diamond(clear/white)................................black

    The prismatic gems/colors represent the colors of the stars. Celestian's symbol is a black circular field with a circle of seven stars upon it. A 1st or 2nd level priest might have ruby or (more likely) red painted stars on the black field, while a 16th+ level priest might have diamonds or white stars. I have the highest level priest of Celestian having an onyx disc holy symbol inset with one of each type of precious gemstone, denoting the relation of the priest to the various ranks, while also denoting that they oversee them all. Only Celestian’s Chosen is allowed to wear the seven different colored gemstones on their holy symbol.

    The raiment colors simply correlate to the colors of the sky, darkening to black as the starry sky is held in the highest regard by the followers of the Star Wanderer. Holy ceremonial vestments I have left as they are described in Greyhawk Adventures: "Black robe covered in stars".


    If I find/recall anything different than what I have posted above then I will further edit these lists.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -


    Last edited by Cebrion on Mon Jan 31, 2005 12:35 am; edited 2 times in total
    Novice

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005
    Posts: 4
    From: Dreamspace

    Send private message
    Sun Jan 23, 2005 1:58 pm  

    Thank you so much, Cebrion! I had seen both the starry black robes and shades of gray with different gems described, but wasn't sure which was current. Since your explanation of the different colors of robes as a darkening night sky makes sense, I'll use that for my character unless the local (Nyrond) Powers That Be tell me differently :P Saresha, currently being 1st level and rather poor, will therefore have red glass in her holy symbol, red stars on her black shield, and a gray robe over her mail. This is going to make mini-painting difficult though... maybe I'll just have my sister (resident artist and mini-painter) do Saresha in black and silver.

    Abysslin and ColdPenguin, thank you for the link and the article! It was an interesting read that spawned all sorts of plot bunnies.
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:07 pm  

    Glad I could be of help Tourmaline.

    To put the shoe on the other foot, do you know where I can find a list of the raiment colors, just so that I know where they heck I remembered them from, and to check that I remembered them correctly? I know I have them written down somewhere, but it has been a long time since I played a priest of Celestian in the ToEE and onwards back in 1987-93.
    It has been over ten years since I have made use of this very specific information.

    Thanks for any help.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    Novice

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005
    Posts: 4
    From: Dreamspace

    Send private message
    Sat Jan 29, 2005 9:48 pm  

    Sorry it's taken me so long to get back to you, Cebrion. RL is like that sometimes. ::sigh:: Life interferes with my gaming!

    Here's a website to check out: Celestian. It seems to be a combination of Spelljammer and Greyhawk. Very interesting, but being new to Greyhawk, I really wasn't sure where the line was, so to speak. There is a list of raiment colors in there- I checked :) The page's author lists his print sources at the bottom, so if you have access to that stuff, the page might give you some pointers on where to start looking.

    Incidentally, Spelljammer sounds like a ton of a lot of fun :D Space travel and magic- how can you go wrong?
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Mon Jan 31, 2005 12:48 am  

    Thanks for the link Tourmaline! Happy That is an excellent write-up on Celestian that Thomas M. Costa did. It covers many aspects of Celestian, and how he and his clergy may interact across the whole range of campaign options.

    One of the main things that I notice about all post-Greyhawk Adventures re-writes on Celestian is regarding the Spheres of Influence. Under the original, there are some major discrepancies regarding how many spells are even available to Celestian's priests at certain levels. Under the original list from GA, there were only two 4th Level Spells available to specialty priests of Celestian(cure serious wounds and neutralize poison) . That is just simply bad. They could have added in a few others, but that was not done. That is a pretty BIG oversight. Tome of Magic added many other options to choose from, many of which suit Celestian very well.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    Novice

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005
    Posts: 4
    From: Dreamspace

    Send private message
    Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:49 am  

    Glad you enjoyed it, Cebrion!

    Just what are Spheres of Influence, anyway? Is that a 1e or 2e thing? I'm a relative newcomer; all the books on my shelf are 3e or 3.5. The whole Spheres bit rather confused me.
    _________________
    I don't suffer from insanity. I rather enjoy it.

    Chocolate: -2 to Will saves
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Tue Feb 01, 2005 2:49 am  

    "Spheres of Influence" are a 2e reference. Under that rules set, cleric spells were defined in a similar way to arcane spells. Think of "spheres of influence" as the cleric version of the wizard's "schools of magic".

    Cleric spells were divided into All(a universal category), Animal, Astral, Charm, Combat, Creation, Divination, Elemental, Guardian, Healing, Necromantic, Plant, Protection, Summoning, Sun, and Weather "spheres”. Later on along came the Tome of Magic, which added some additional spheres of influence, such as Numbers, Travelers, and others.

    Each deity has there own list of accessible "spheres” which when compiled made a list of spells available to their priests. Major access to a sphere of influence meant that all spells in that category were on the list of usable spells, while minor access to a sphere meant that only spells of 3rd level and lower were accessible. It was an interesting idea and a great way to differentiate the faiths, but it has its flaws. Many of the priesthoods were not very balanced when compared to each other, mainly with regard to the number of spells that comprised the final list, and their gained powers. Most people just tweaked the various write-ups to be more equal.

    3e+ solved this problem with the advent of giving all faiths equal access to a complete generic cleric spell list, with bonus spells based upon the sphere of influence, or Domains that each deity has as their specialty. This is much more equitable, though slightly more generic. Clerics in 2e were very similar to what a cleric is now, except that there would be no domain access and just the communal list of “cleric spells”, the ability to wear any armor, and the restriction on only using blunt weapons. Different from clerics in 2e are the “specialty priests”. These are clerics that exemplify the tenets of the faith in a way that goes far beyond what the cleric does. The write-ups on the various GH specialty priests in 2e included variant weapon usage, restrictions on armor and shields, and usually a list of powers that were gained by the priest as they advanced in level. The specialty priest really created a very unique difference among the priests of the various gods. They had access to different spells, armor, weapons, and powers. Most people use (d) the specialty priest entries in their campaigns, and not clerics at all, just to play up these differences.

    I’d say that the 2e specialty priest most directly compares to various cleric prestige classes in 3e+, except that the specialty priest is a base class. You are either a cleric or a specialty priest, but not both.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    Display posts from previous:   
       Canonfire Forum Index -> World of Greyhawk Discussion All times are GMT - 8 Hours
    Page 1 of 1

    Jump to:  

    You cannot post new topics in this forum
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum
    You cannot edit your posts in this forum
    You cannot delete your posts in this forum
    You cannot vote in polls in this forum




    Canonfire! is a production of the Thursday Group in assocation with GREYtalk and Canonfire! Enterprises

    Contact the Webmaster.  Long Live Spidasa!


    Greyhawk Gothic Font by Darlene Pekul is used under the Creative Commons License.

    PHP-Nuke Copyright © 2005 by Francisco Burzi. This is free software, and you may redistribute it under the GPL. PHP-Nuke comes with absolutely no warranty, for details, see the license.
    Page Generation: 0.47 Seconds