[IronGolem]

I recently stumbled onto a Grehawk regional feet [Blackmoorian Rhymes] in Dragon #315 that references the Rhymers of Blackmoor. Is there a canon source for this group, other than this feat?

[mtg]

Lacking access to my books (in storage), I can't check, but I recall that entry as relating to a bardic / druidic Old Faith-esque tradition.

[IronGolem]

The Encyclopedia Greyhawkia has an entry for the Rhymers of the Blackfens [Dance With Demons, pg. 26]. The entry reads:

"The fabled Rhymers of the Blackfens, those northern mages who with kanteel and verse wrought world-shaking dweomers, might exceed the troubador's own ability in magic. On the other hand, it was in that land of snow and ice that Gellor had won his own kanteel and brought back great spells for his own repertoire. Gord doubted that any of the great druidic bards would care to challenge the one-eyed troubador to a challenge of skill in that vein. Perhaps Gellor was as great as any man or elf, then, when it came to the weaving of spells by music and verse."

I could see Gygax having to change Blackmoor/Gloomfens to Blackfens in order to not have to worry about copyright violations or something, and then Paizo going ahead and using the intended name in their Dragon article when they weren't under the same restrictions.

NOW I really want to know more about these MAGES who wove spells by music and verse! Is this where Heward learned his stuff, or why Otto has such an interest in the connection between music and magic?

[smillan_31]

What the heck is a kanteel? I googled it and the only thing that came up was it was Dutch for a merlon. Oops, never mind. I think he meant a kantele. It's a Finnish instrument, so in this case that sort of makes sense.

[SirXaris]

[mtg]

Thanks for the productive research IronGolem. For Gygax, I understand that "the weaving of spells by music and verse" was represented by AD&D 1e bards.

I've not followed their permutations carefully but recall a revision in an early Dragon or The Dragon magazine.

Also, Paul Stormberg published an excellent article on the subject in the Oerth Journal volume II, issue 15 -- [b[By Sword and Song: Notes on the Old Faith Bards of the Flanaess[/b] and accompanied by his The Nature of Druids in the Flanaess: the Old Faith.

Brief descriptions are available http://www.canonfire.com/cfhtml/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=389, and the issue can be downloaded http://www.oerthjournal.com/oerthjournals/OJ_15.pdf.

In 3xE, I recall there was a prestige class that attempted to approximate the old bard character class, incorporating some druid-esque features. I recall thinking it was a nice idea but limited structurally from fully representing the Old Faith / Old Lore bard.

[rasgon]

This is a pretty straightforward reference to the song magic practiced in the Kalevala by heroes such as Vainamoinen (famously the inventor of the kantele) and Lemminkainen.

[SirXaris]

[rasgon]

Yeah, that'd be my first reference if I were creating high-level Rhymer of Blackmoor NPCs.

I'd also look at the story "Wall of Serpents" by Fletcher Pratt and L. Sprague de Camp, part of the Enchanter series mentioned in the 1st edition DMG's list of inspirational works. And the Kalevala itself.

[IronGolem]

[Argon]

"In the bleak swamps of Blackmoor, I reside."
"Incantations of old faiths are locked within."
"Some of purity, others of sin."
"Those of the Blackfen's, will often chide."
"Beware the Rhymer's, songs and rites."
"Sweet lyrical chantings are constantly sung."
"Many a fool unwilling done."
"Invade the Blackfen's, and you will be one."

See I have the Feat!

[mtg]

Hey IronGolem, reviewing the novel quotation again, I wonder whether the term "troubador" was a term of art for Gygax.

Does anyone recall whether that indicated an unpublished home-brew class? If not, I'd follow rasgon's advice, and imagine a group of Flan quasi-deities or hero-deities (edit) based upon the Finnish mythos.

If anyone has suggestions for how to represent Rhymers of Blackmoor in 3.5e or Pathfinder, I'd love to see them.

[Le Noir Faineant]

Coming from the Arnesonian angle of things, I can report that this is not a creation from the FFC.

The Arnesonian game had Wokans, though, that were some sorts of proto-Druids/Bards.
So, there is SOME info out there. Somewhere.

The ideas from the thread are pretty cool, though!
I shall enjoy stealing them!
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[Argon]

Le Noir Faineant,

Cut purse, sneak thief, turtledove, etc.

Stealing other peoples ideas shameful simply shameful.

What are you a fan of RPG games or something?

All kidding aside take what you can for your game.

Later

Argon

[Le Noir Faineant]

We're having a discussion over at the CBI about Blackmoor in the Stone Age, and talk has been about what role bards (oral traditions of magic) have in more primitive societies.

I think I will link this one there.



...Or, quote it, and pretend the smart parts of the thread are my creation.

Just for reference, the place where I will steal your IP: http://blackmoor.mystara.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=2793

You got to register there to read, though.
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[smillan_31]

[Le Noir Faineant]

I think it's a wordplay on "wiccan", actually.

The name "wokan" is a surname from Germany, but apparently it derrives from an old word for "racketeer". So, it doesn't seem to make much sense.

But then, I think this was a 3e addition to Blackmoor, and some of those were pretty random. Could be anything, really.
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[rasgon]

[smillan_31]

I wondered if it might be derived from "wakan," which is Lakota for "power, spirit, etc...".

[rasgon]

Quite possibly!

[Le Noir Faineant]

Wow, that's a great find! Another mystery solved.
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