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Journeyman Greytalker
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 1:37 am
Itar and Atarra
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I've found a few nifty articles on Canonfire! about Itar and Atarra. Can anyone tell me where the "official" source material can be found?
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:23 am
Re: Itar and Atarra
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| ephealy wrote: |
| I've found a few nifty articles on Canonfire! about Itar and Atarra. Can anyone tell me where the "official" source material can be found? |
I think Itar was first mentioned in 'Rary the Traitor'. Some more information is probably on LGJ article about hero deities. If I remember correctly it had stuff on Vathris that was their patron deity.
S.H, the guy from Naerie
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Master Greytalker
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 5:25 am
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Simpi's dead on here.
Rary the Traitor was the first Canon mention of either realm.
As well as the one Simpi mentioned, there was a two part LGJ (Living Greyhawk Journal) article by Creighton Broadhurst about the Bright Desert that included some locations relating to old Itar.
And I don't know how official you consider Living Greyhawk, but the Bright Sands core arc (thus available to all, regardless of location) deals strongly with the Bright and its history.
P.
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:01 am
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Apologies if this is a stupid question, but are Vathris and Atarra the same fallen godling? And if so, what (if anything) is the significance of the two different names? Thanks in advance. P.
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GreySage
Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:49 am
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| Prochytes wrote: |
| Apologies if this is a stupid question, but are Vathris and Atarra the same fallen godling? |
Yes: the former Itarian god of progress and ingenuity.
| Quote: |
| And if so, what (if anything) is the significance of the two different names? Thanks in advance. P. |
You'd have to ask Erik Mona. It's probably a copyright thing.
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Forum Moderator
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From: Ullinois
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Thu Jan 26, 2006 5:27 pm
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We had a discussion about Attara and Vathris late late late last night in greytalk, started by ephealy (sorry bud you missed the best of it). Long story short, the best way to resolve Attara (Erik's apochryphal name for the deity) and Vathris (the only name given in the published LGJ #5) is to say Attara was his name prior to his death at the final battle vs Sulm. After this when he rises from the dead as the hero-god of Revenge and so on, he is Vathris. The description even says he looks different and carries the barbed spear that was used to slay him. It should be noted that he actually was knocked down a rung when he was killed and Itar was wiped out. Demi-god to Hero-god. If this isn't a good case for devotional power I don't know what is.
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:46 am
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| mortellan wrote: |
| Long story short, the best way to resolve Attara (Erik's apochryphal name for the deity) and Vathris (the only name given in the published LGJ #5) is to say Attara was his name prior to his death at the final battle vs Sulm. After this when he rises from the dead as the hero-god of Revenge and so on, he is Vathris. |
That is a very nice solution. One might even, perhaps, take it a little bit further. Suppose that Ancient Flan was structured a little like some of the Semitic languages or (to a much lesser extent) Classical Greek, so that the same group of consonants could generate different related words by putting different vowels around them. In that case, "Itar" and "Atarra" might have been derived from the same root (perhaps a Flan word for "ingenuity", vel sim.?). This would give even more point to Vathris' change of name when his country was obliterated. Apologies for repeition if this has been said before (and most examples of Modern Flan I have seen look more like Gaelic anyway, about which I do not know enough to comment).
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:41 am
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| Prochytes wrote: |
That is a very nice solution. One might even, perhaps, take it a little bit further. Suppose that Ancient Flan was structured a little like some of the Semitic languages or (to a much lesser extent) Classical Greek, so that the same group of consonants could generate different related words by putting different vowels around them. In that case, "Itar" and "Atarra" might have been derived from the same root (perhaps a Flan word for "ingenuity", vel sim.?). This would give even more point to Vathris' change of name when his country was obliterated. Apologies for repeition if this has been said before (and most examples of Modern Flan I have seen look more like Gaelic anyway, about which I do not know enough to comment). |
Could work. After all, if you look at what they've written for LG 'Bright Sands campaign arc book' it shows that Flan nomads of the Bright use term 'Aurifar' for Pelor.
S.H, the guy from Naerie
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Journeyman Greytalker
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Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:08 pm
Bright Desert Bibliography
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I did some rearch trying to find all the source material on the Bright Desert. I was actually looking for everything that could help complete my picture of Old Itar, but since there is only a few references, I broadened my scope. Anyway, here is what I found:
- Rary the Traitor (WGR3) (TSR 9386) by Anthony Pryor; 1992.
- Living Greyhawk Gazetteer by Gary Holian, Erik Mona, Sean K Reynolds, Frederick Weining; 2000.
- “Blood of Heroes” by Sean K Reynolds, Fred Weining, and Erik Mona; Living Greyhawk Journal 3; February 2001.
- “Into the Bright Desert” by Creighton Broadhurst; Living Greyhawk Journal 21, Polyhedron 157, Dungeon Magazine 98
- “Denizens of the Bright Desert” by Creighton Broadhurst; Living Greyhawk Journal 26, Polyhedron 162, Dungeon Magazine 103; October 2003.
- “Hardby: City of the Scorned” by Paul Looby; Living Greyhawk Journal 32, Polyhedron 168, Dungeon Magazine 109; April 2004.
Living Greyhawk Adventures
URD1-02 To Save the Scouring Wind by Chris Lindsay
URD1-07 Fools Gold by Jonathan Ingram
COR1-08 The Future's Bright by Creighton Broadhurst
URD1-11 Incident at Kiddeky Crossing by Richard Hubbard
URD2-04 Bright Prospects by Jonathan Ingram
COR2-08 Echo by Stephen Radney-MacFarland
COR3-01 The Hidden Fortress by Creighton Broadhurst
Blight on Bright Sands Sourcebook (Living Greyhawk Campaign); April 2005.
COR5-06 Blood on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Apr05)
COR5-09 Gateway to the Bright Sands (595 CY) (Aug05 / Origins ‘05)
CORS5-02 Mines of Father Eye (595 CY) (Aug05 / Origins)
COR5-11 Dark Deceit on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Aug05)
COR5-17 Time’s Tide on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Nov05)
COR5-20 Phantoms of the Bright Sands (595 CY) (Jan06 / GenCon SoCal ‘05)
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Sun Jan 29, 2006 2:24 am
Re: Bright Desert Bibliography
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COR3-13 Traitor's Road by Paul 'Woesinger' Looby
NYR4-01 Towers of Abbor-Alz by Troy McNemar
Both of them, while not exactly concentrating on Itar, give some glimpses to Bright Desert.
COR6-02 A Rallying Point for the Bright Sands By Chris Chesher and Greg Marks should also be out shortly.
S.H, the guy from Naerie
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Journeyman Greytalker
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Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:32 am
Re: Bright Desert Bibliography
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| Simpi wrote: |
| COR6-02 A Rallying Point for the Bright Sands By Chris Chesher and Greg Marks should also be out shortly. |
That is the Origins 2006 release, right? The first one for 596 CY?
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Sun Jan 29, 2006 8:12 am
Re: Bright Desert Bibliography
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| ephealy wrote: |
| Simpi wrote: |
| COR6-02 A Rallying Point for the Bright Sands By Chris Chesher and Greg Marks should also be out shortly. |
That is the Origins 2006 release, right? The first one for 596 CY? |
No, it comes out in March according to Core schedule: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=lg/lgcn/20051227a
S.H, the guy from Naerie
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Journeyman Greytalker
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Mon Jan 30, 2006 3:03 am
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I found another one...
“The Return of the Pick-axe” by Christopher McKitterick; TSR Jam 1999; 1999.
It's a 591 CY adventure to help Clan Highforge reclaim something of value from Azak-Zil in the Abbor Alz.
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Journeyman Greytalker
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Mon Jan 30, 2006 3:24 am
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And...
Crypt of Lyzandred the Mad (TSR 9580) by Sean Reynolds; 1998. [ Mentions that Lyzandred pulled down the meteor that caused the dwarves of Clan Highforge to create the mine-pits of Azak-Zil. ]
And... (doh)
Greyhawk Adventures (TSR 2023) by James M. Ward; 1988.
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Journeyman Greytalker
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Mon Jan 30, 2006 3:31 am
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Since my original list was so lacking... here's the updated one...
PRIMARY (AD&D) SOURCE MATERIAL
Greyhawk Adventures (TSR 2023) by James M. Ward; 1988.
Rary the Traitor (WGR3) (TSR 9386) by Anthony Pryor; 1992.
Crypt of Lyzandred the Mad (TSR 9580) by Sean Reynolds; 1998. [ Mentions that Lyzandred pulled down the meteor that caused the dwarves of Clan Highforge to create the mine-pits of Azak-Zil. ]
“The Return of the Pick-axe” by Christopher McKitterick; TSR Jam 1999; 1999. [ 591 CY adventure to help Clan Highforge reclaim something of value from Azak-Zil in the Abbor Alz. ]
LIVING GREYHAWK SOURCE MATERIAL
Living Greyhawk Gazetteer by Gary Holian, Erik Mona, Sean K Reynolds, Frederick Weining; 2000.
“Blood of Heroes” by Sean K Reynolds, Fred Weining, and Erik Mona; Living Greyhawk Journal 3; February 2001. [ Information on Vathris. ]
Living Greyhawk Adventures
1 URD1-02 To Save the Scouring Wind by Chris Lindsay
2 URD1-07 Fools Gold by Jonathan Ingram
3 COR1-08 The Future's Bright by Creighton Broadhurst
4 URD1-11 Incident at Kiddeky Crossing by Richard Hubbard
5 URD2-04 Bright Prospects by Jonathan Ingram
6 COR2-08 Echo by Stephen Radney-MacFarland
7 COR3-01 The Hidden Fortress by Creighton Broadhurst
8 COR3-13 Traitor's Road by Paul 'Woesinger' Looby
9 NYR4-01 Towers of Abbor-Alz by Troy McNemar
“Into the Bright Desert” by Creighton Broadhurst; Living Greyhawk Journal 21, Polyhedron 157, Dungeon Magazine 98; May 2003. [ All about the lands Rary controls. ]
“Denizens of the Bright Desert” by Creighton Broadhurst; Living Greyhawk Journal 26, Polyhedron 162, Dungeon Magazine 103; October 2003. [ Stat blocks for Rary the Traitor, Eliazir Razeem Azam'ut of the Muddled Tongue, Shemaya, and Kumhaik. Moster stats for the Desert Troll and Hueleneaer (Desert Centaur). ]
“Hardby: City of the Scorned” by Paul Looby; Living Greyhawk Journal 32, Polyhedron 168, Dungeon Magazine 109; April 2004. [ Details political connections and plot hooks between Hardby and the Bright Lands / Desert. ]
Blight on Bright Sands Sourcebook (Living Greyhawk Campaign); April 2005.
1 COR5-06 Blood on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Apr05)
2 COR5-09 Gateway to the Bright Sands (595 CY) (Aug05 / Origins ‘05)
3 CORS5-02 Mines of Father Eye (595 CY) (Aug05 / Origins)
4 COR5-11 Dark Deceit on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Aug05)
5 COR5-17 Time’s Tide on Bright Sands (595 CY) (Nov05)
6 COR5-20 Phantoms of the Bright Sands (595 CY) (Jan06 / GenCon SoCal ‘05)
7 COR6-02 Rallying Point for the Bright Sands (???)
OTHER SOURCE MATERIAL
“Reflections in Silica: Sulm and Itar” by Erik Mona.
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