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    Canonfire :: View topic - using other settings to expand Oerth
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    using other settings to expand Oerth
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    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:45 am  
    using other settings to expand Oerth

    I'd like to gather peoples' thoughts on the use of stuff from other settings to expand and dveleop Oerth. Has anyone plunked Barovia into the Crsytlamists? Maybe used some of the FR material to develop the fabulous lands of Western Oerik, etc.?

    Last edited by CombatMedic on Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:21 am  

    I steal little bits to flesh out cultures in the Flaness and right now I am running the old Isle of Dread Module and using it in sort of a bermuda triangle/lost world sot of fashion. Essentially the island disappears and reappears as it shifts between different worlds. I am using the Warforged from Eberon as a magic construct race that will eventually be discovered, it hasn't happed yet. ANd I am using the Dragonlance Towers of High Sorcery as the model for my Royal Academies of Wizardry.


    One group (The IoD characters) are looking for the root of a tree that is supposedly usable as a cure for ghoul fever and the other group of characters are trying to find the location of a necromancers laboratory, a necromancer who learned how to bind living souls into constructs (an opportunity for me to introduce Eberons Warforged race).

    The Island itself I have set up as a Domain (Ravenloft) for the first character I ever played. When I first started playing D&D like 20 years ago (I was 11 at the time) I played a Mage named Orobus. I originally typed out an entire plot summation but in the interest of brevity I chopped it down, if you are interested in reading the plot line I well be posting it on ObsidianPortal.com soon and linking it to my plot line profile here. Anyway, Orobus was my very first character from my very first Montey Haul game and he eventually became a God. He became a God on his return trip from the Isle of Dread by killing the Greek sorceress Cerce when she met us and attacked us at the docks of Specularum (a major city in The Known World/Mystara setting). My best friends character and therefore my characters companion in the game was a cleric named Dr. Death. When the three died Circe, was was an Immortal of the Sphere of Chaos (an old Basic D&D idea on divinity) fused all of our essences togeather. The resulting gestalt character was created by the DM running and went on to bigger and better things, eventually going on the tried and true D&D standby of "Killing everything in the two monster manuals, the Fiend Folio and the deities and Demigods book" But I digress....

    My campaign involves elements from Dragonlance, Ravenloft, Eberon and Mystara. I may involve elements from Dark Sun when I take the game into the Sea of Dust but thats not going to happen for a long time. My most useful and therefore important gaming supplement though isn't a gaming supplement. Its a 1950's era USAF survival guide, a book that I have to say has been more helpful in creating Man VS. Nature scenarios then the old Wilderness survival guide or the 3.5 versions (Stormwrack, Frostburn and Sandstorm) have been.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 12:48 pm  

    Oh, looks like my first couple of attempts at getting this topic posted showed up after all- but are all messed up. Weird. Sorry about that, they didn't show up right away. I hope the mods can fix it. Thanks. Smile
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:04 pm  

    Sounds cool. I especially like to use Isle of Dread in GH [I think it fits in just fine- apparently Erik Mona and the Paizo dudes think so, too Smile ]


    This was lost in the compu-gremlins attack on my initial post, but I've been considering mixing in some Wilderlands [from Judges Guild] Probably not the new [and very nice, from what I've seen] D20 version, but the old and sketchy JG stuff from the late 70's /Early 80s. It's all available on PDF for pretty cheap prices.

    GH is , to me, an even mix of Howard/Vance/Lieber swords and sorcery and Tolkienian high fantasy. Wilderlands seems to slant more towards the swords and sorcery end of the scale. That might be cool- to contrast the relatively civilized and enlightened Flanaess with the somehwat unsettled and barbaric Wilderlands. There are several possible connections between the two settings, like the whole Valley of the Ancients/City of the Gods/Blackmoor thing. Skandiks could be Suel barbarians who tarvelled further west, maybe mixing with some minor native tribes. Etc.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:47 pm  

    Never heard of it but from the sounds of it, Wilderlands may fit in pretty well North of the Great Kingdom among the Snow and Ice Barbarians.

    I have been wanting to run a game were everyone plays Wolf Nomads based of Gygax's Mika-Oba books. Everyone would have a choice of playing Druids, Barbarians or Rangers at first level. From there they could branch out, but those would be the starting classes.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:09 pm  

    I just got done running the FR Kidnapped module out of Dyvers.

    I also plan on using the Hellgate Keep as a ruined fortress in the Empire of Iuz.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:48 pm  

    I just bought the Pirates Guide to Freeport. Pretty good stuff. I think I can easily rework it into GH. Probably as part of the Lordship of of Isles or maybe the Hold of the Sea Princes.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Sun Aug 03, 2008 10:05 pm  

    CombatMedic... could you delete the last line in your first post? (by clicking on "edit" within that post box). This thread is next to impossible to read as long as that line is there.

    Denis, aka "Maldin"
    Maldin's Greyhawk
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    Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:29 am  

    manus-nigrum wrote:
    Never heard of it but from the sounds of it, Wilderlands may fit in pretty well North of the Great Kingdom among the Snow and Ice Barbarians.

    I have been wanting to run a game were everyone plays Wolf Nomads based of Gygax's Mika-Oba books. Everyone would have a choice of playing Druids, Barbarians or Rangers at first level. From there they could branch out, but those would be the starting classes.


    Those weren't written by Gygax, they were written by Rose Estes. (Yes, I'm quite sure; I just went back to my bookshelves to check.)

    It was an interesting series, if not really canon. Gave an interesting view of Wolf Nomad society. It's been a while since I read those books, didn't all the adults of the tribe have a wolf animal companion?

    Several of the fictional elements were flagrantly against the rules. While that doesn't really matter for fiction, if the players are familiar with the source material make sure they understand how far you're willing to go in changing (or not, as the case may be) the rules to fit the source material.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:31 pm  

    Maldin wrote:
    CombatMedic... could you delete the last line in your first post? (by clicking on "edit" within that post box). This thread is next to impossible to read as long as that line is there.

    Denis, aka "Maldin"
    Maldin's Greyhawk


    Ah, fixed it.

    Well, I think I've mostly got Freeport figured out. It will be in the Lordship of the Isles. I will probably make it the ''Free Port of Sulward'' or some such, filling in for a city already on the map. Gods aren't too hard to adapt, thanks to the generic nature of the material. I'm keeping the Mythos elements more or less as is.


    Last edited by CombatMedic on Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Master Greytalker

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    Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:01 am  

    http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drfe/20080801a

    What do people think about using the article on Mithrendain as inspiration for Enstad?
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Fri Aug 08, 2008 9:23 pm  

    Greyhawk has a dubious history of technology, which not every fan has embraced. I took the liberties to yank the Warforged from Eberron and drop them into Blackmoor as the clockwork army of an ancient empire (the heirs of Leuk-O). Wonky modules such as Expedition to the Barrier Peaks were updated for a more serious treatment as dwarven miners uncovered an ancient "Stock Pile." The two groups are linked as reserves to a once powerful empire that has crumbled since. Granted, this isn't very GH and less Eberron but I like it like that.

    Also, I stole the Shifters and dropped them in the Wolf and Tiger nomads. Rather than have rumors of Lycanthrope I added two new races of "Beastmen" (those nebulous monster-men of early editions). The beastmen of the north have two basic features - feline and canine - which has divided them into two large groups. The Baklunish hordes that occupy the north as barbarians live in symbiosis with the respective beastmen, creating a curious mixture of ancient baklunish traditions and inhuman tribal rites. The Baklunes are often more savage than the beastmen, making an accurate census impossible.

    My take - if you like it, steal it
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Sat Aug 09, 2008 8:32 am  

    Hmmmmm..........

    Well, to answer PaulN6, I think Mithrendain could be adapted for Enstad.


    AtomicPope- a couple of guys have talked about adapting Warforged for Blackmoor. I personally like the idea- although I think I'd leave them as actual robots- not magical automatons. Of course, they represent a sufficiently advanced technology, and so would be regarded as magical by anyone who didn't know better [detect magic spell, for example] In any case, the technology to create them is so far ahead of the medieval level of most of GH, that little practical knowledge could be gained by taking one apart. They would have to ''eat'' by consuming power sources or fuel of some kind. Possibly they are solar powered- or maybe they eat magic itself, having been modified so that their ''radiant engines'' work off of dweomer-essence.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Sat Aug 09, 2008 11:23 am  

    CombatMedic wrote:
    Has anyone plunked Barovia into the Crsytlamists?


    This sounds very cool. Maybe at in the western mountains at the edge of Sterich?

    CombatMedic wrote:
    I just bought the Pirates Guide to Freeport. Pretty good stuff. I think I can easily rework it into GH. Probably as part of the Lordship of of Isles or maybe the Hold of the Sea Princes.


    Chris Pramas actually intended it to be in the Lordship of the Isles. IMC, I use Freeport in the Olman Islands.

    AtomicPope wrote:
    Greyhawk has a dubious history of technology, which not every fan has embraced. I took the liberties to yank the Warforged from Eberron and drop them into Blackmoor as the clockwork army of an ancient empire (the heirs of Leuk-O). Wonky modules such as Expedition to the Barrier Peaks were updated for a more serious treatment as dwarven miners uncovered an ancient "Stock Pile." The two groups are linked as reserves to a once powerful empire that has crumbled since. Granted, this isn't very GH and less Eberron but I like it like that.

    Also, I stole the Shifters and dropped them in the Wolf and Tiger nomads.


    I like it alot. I do not care for Eberron but it has lots of cool elements that are immenently steal worthy. I too have added Eberron elements, including the Warforged in a similar role as well as the Shifters. I haven't figured out how yet but I'm going to place Sharn and Xendrick in GH as well.

    After Mona and Holian committed "Grand Theft Greyhawk" and stole the Isle of Dread for Greyhawk from Mystara, I think everything is potentially fair game.

    I just got a cheap copy of Ed Greenwood's Castlemourn setting and I'm thinking it could well serve as the southern edge of Hyperborea or "Polaria." (I don't like the Realms but Greenwood, from back in his Nine Hells days, is a good designer when he's not creating Elminster and his harem the Seven Sisters as a vicarious display of exhibitionism).

    I also think Pathfinder's Varisia is very stealable, although I'm somewhat less sure about the rest of Golarion.
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    Sun Aug 10, 2008 7:28 pm  

    GVDammerung wrote:
    I like it alot. I do not care for Eberron but it has lots of cool elements that are immenently steal worthy. I too have added Eberron elements, including the Warforged in a similar role as well as the Shifters. I haven't figured out how yet but I'm going to place Sharn and Xendrick in GH as well.

    Sharn is tricky since the essence of Sharn, as the "center" of the world, would conflict with Greyhawk. However, I thought of using Sharn as the model for the capital of Zeif, unimaginatively named Zeif Laughing Of course, changing the name to Sharn would spice things up a bit. I imagined the Zeif, the City of Towers as sporting hundreds of skyward minarets, mixing Muslim/Indian architectures such as the Taj Mahal with the Kremlin. Zeif rests on the farthest corner of the known world. Sharn/Zeif could be a cosmopolitan center of the far side of the world.

    Unfortunately I haven't taken any campaigns in the direction of Zeif, not since the late 80's. And even then the goal was to sail farther than the known world to Hyperboria so exposure was limited. The players were interested in new lands, even though they'd never traveled to Zeif. One player was taken by my effusive details but one doesn't always sway the many. Bah! I was half-tempted to railroad and I still regret not doing it.
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    Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:08 pm  

    I use any and all AlQadim supplements for Zeif, Tusmit, Ull, the Paynims and the Sea of Dust.
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    Tue Aug 12, 2008 10:35 am  

    SUPrUNown wrote:
    I use any and all AlQadim supplements for Zeif, Tusmit, Ull, the Paynims and the Sea of Dust.


    AQ is a great resource from which to draw material!

    With respect to the Sea of Dust, I like to steal some bits from Dark Sun.
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    Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:58 pm  

    CombatMedic wrote:
    I just bought the Pirates Guide to Freeport. Pretty good stuff. I think I can easily rework it into GH. Probably as part of the Lordship of of Isles or maybe the Hold of the Sea Princes.

    GVDammerung wrote:
    Chris Pramas actually intended it to be in the Lordship of the Isles. IMC, I use Freeport in the Olman Islands.


    An interesting Idea, to say the least. That would definately give them a more Conquistador feel, since the Olman Islands are absolutely Aztec in nature. I have looked, but never played Freeport, but I would consider using material from there ... perhaps in the Pirate Isles. I think that would feel right. Both are good. I ahve always had a difficult pinning down the Lordship of the Isles, though. I love historical games, and really like the idea of using Freepot as material. I have long wanted to, but "canon-fear" always kept me from it.

    AtomicPope wrote:
    Greyhawk has a dubious history of technology, which not every fan has embraced. I took the liberties to yank the Warforged from Eberron and drop them into Blackmoor as the clockwork army of an ancient empire (the heirs of Leuk-O). Wonky modules such as Expedition to the Barrier Peaks were updated for a more serious treatment as dwarven miners uncovered an ancient "Stock Pile." The two groups are linked as reserves to a once powerful empire that has crumbled since. Granted, this isn't very GH and less Eberron but I like it like that.

    Also, I stole the Shifters and dropped them in the Wolf and Tiger nomads.


    I have never been one to want to use Eberron, as it is decidedly non-GH, but were I to use the Warforged, the City of the Gods and Blackmoor would certainly be the place for it. Also, I hadn't ever considered the Shifters as fitting into the Nomads (or the old Tabaxi and Tabaxi Lords of Hepmonaland.) Nice. Thanks for the idea. They also work well for were-jaguars of the Amedio. There are feline Shifters, right? Also, the Catfolk would fit in nicely among the Tiger Nomads for a more "normal" seeming group of feline people (also nice for the Tabaxi). I happen to love the Nomads. I have a huge thing for Ghengis Khan and his decendants, and sometimes I don't think that people know that the Nomads are based very historically in parallel to the Mongols. ((BTW - if you've haven't see the new movie "Mongol" you should.))

    I am not one for wholesale dropping other campaigns into GH, but little tidbits are nice as source sometimes. Both would require reworking to fit in the history and background, but the basics for the races would be nice. I am glad to see that others are open to the idea of adapting material without really changing GH canon. I personally have used alot of real-world historical material for both the Olman and the Nomads, not to mention merging European Gypsies and the Sea Gypsies of Myanmar to approximate the Rhenee. Anyone else like historical gaming pulled into GH? I would love to hear about Historical RPG's to use as reference.
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    Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:26 pm  

    Also, I have stolen liberally from the Expert modules MASTER OF THE DESERT NOMADS and TEMPLE OF DEATH for locales within the Sea of Dust / Plains of the Paynims.
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    Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:53 pm  

    I'm adapting Under Illefarn to the County of Ulek near the Lortmils. Placement in an established area like the County loses the frontier atmosphere, requiring some adjustments to the Caravan Duty sidetrek, but the history of Laughing Hollow works with the County's demihuman population and Turrosh Mak's invasion of the Lortmils up to Celene Pass provides a good excuse for orcs to be hiding out in the dungeon.

    Endless Armies, probably the best of the lame Maztica products, could work with a party starting in the Lordship Isles and traveling to Hepmonaland.

    SUPrUNown wrote:
    Also, I have stolen liberally from the Expert modules MASTER OF THE DESERT NOMADS and TEMPLE OF DEATH for locales within the Sea of Dust / Plains of the Paynims.


    I like Master of the Desert Nomads a lot. I have Temple of Death and Red Arrow Black Shield but haven't read them yet. It's too bad Greyhawk has such a limited supply of desert settings. Looking X4, X5, X10, B4 The Lost City, I10 The Day of Al'Akbar, and the I3-5 The Desert of Desolation series it's almost impossible to find a location for everything!

    CombatMedic wrote:

    Has anyone plunked Barovia into the Crsytlamists?


    I touched on this in another thread, but I think the Duchy of Urnst is an excellent location for Barovia--there's mountains to the west, crumbling architecture, corruption, insane nobles, and lots of dark secrets in the hills (Maure Castle, the Ghost Tower of Inverness, the Pits of Arzak-Zil, etc). The Duchy also has a pre-cataclysm history with early Suel settlers and it's located between two fallen empires, the Isles of Woe and Sulm. Most importantly, there's a strong Rhennee presence in the Duchy.

    Of course, there are other considerations. I only have the I6 module and haven't read later Strahd material or Expedition... I also need to catch up with all of the Duchy's developments in OJ23. Finally, I noticed today that Dongul already wrote an article on the subject here.
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    Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:48 am  

    vestcoat wrote:
    I only have the I6 module and haven't read later Strahd material or Expedition...


    Ugh... I want to cry...

    Sadly Wizards has butchered one of the all time greatest villains in D&D history. Strahd has been emasculated and given a bunch of new hokey powers at the same time. I mean for starters, look at his new F'ing picture for christ sakes. He looks more like he belongs on the cover of a Paul Revere and the Raiders album now then the fearsome Darklord, damned to rule over a god forsaken, blasted, hell whole of a Domain in the demiplane of Dread.

    They have cut Barovia down from Eternal Prison designed specifically to torment you down to the level of Chinese Finger Trap.







    Wizards of the Coast. Constantly going out of their way in their efforts of proving that newer, does not necessarily mean better.
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    Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:06 am  

    manus-nigrum wrote:
    . . . Sadly Wizards has butchered one of the all time greatest villains in D&D history. Strahd has been emasculated and given a bunch of new hokey powers at the same time. I mean for starters, look at his new F'ing picture for christ sakes. He looks more like he belongs on the cover of a Paul Revere and the Raiders album now then the fearsome Darklord, damned to rule over a god forsaken, blasted, hell whole of a Domain in the demiplane of Dread. . . .





    ROFL! Laughing Too funny! Happy But yeah, its a shame. Confused
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    Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:02 am  

    Thanks for fixing that first post, CombatMedic... Much easier to read now! Smile

    I've used a variety of non-GH products in my Greyhawk. Several of the Harnworld cities serve as GH cities (for example, I use Tashal as my Verbobonc... about the right size and geography). The two Dwarven supplements (Kiraz and Azadmere) have been placed, as well as the Elven supplement (Evael). Other aspects of Harn have also been adopted, such as placing all of the Earthmaster ruins around the Flanaess map. (Hey! I should do up an Earthmaster location map for the website!)

    I placed the Bloodstone series of FR mods (H1-4) in the mountains and cold plains north of Tenh.

    The Dark Sun boxed set City by the Silt Sea serves as a Suel ruin on the edge of the Sea of Dust. I've toyed with using the Valley of Dust and Fire as a magically protected oasis in the center of the Sea of Dust, and THE Dragon as the transformed sole-survivor of the Suel Council and last Ruler of the destroyed Suel Empire.

    I'll post more adopted non-Greyhawk material (and there is more) as I think of it. Wink

    Denis, aka "Maldin"
    Maldin's Greyhawk http://melkot.com
    Loads of edition-independent Greyhawk goodness... maps, mysteries, magic, mechanics, and more!!!
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    Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:51 pm  

    Since we're talking about using supplements to flesh out Greyhawk....

    Does anyone know where to get a COMPLETE PDF of the Al Qadim LAND OF FATE box set? The one available on Paizo's website and a few other sites I've looked at buying from only has the Adventurer's Handbook part of the box set available,, none of the maps or other goodies, and I can't find one on eBay (or at least can't find one that is affordable). Anyeone out there know a place that has complete copies of the PDF?
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    Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:36 pm  

    Land of Fate on ebay for $9 Buy-It-Now
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    Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:05 am  

    Yeah, I saw that auction after I posted my message. I might bite, but I wish I culd find a PDF instead... I'm slowly trying to pare down the actual physical amounts of stuff I have, and get more into electronic.... I can fit an entire shelf of my Greyhawk stuff onto one CD. But, I may have to break down...
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