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    Canonfire :: View topic - Return to the Keep on the Borderlands
    Canonfire Forum Index -> Greyhawk- AD&D 2nd Edition
    Return to the Keep on the Borderlands
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    Adept Greytalker

    Joined: Oct 07, 2008
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    Mon Apr 13, 2009 6:31 pm  
    Return to the Keep on the Borderlands

    Did the "Return" module flesh out the Cave of the Unknown? If so, what did TSR put in there?
    Adept Greytalker

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    Mon Apr 13, 2009 9:34 pm  
    I Did Some Searching...

    And I didn't see if TSR had fleshed it out but I did find a couple of people that made their own and posted them.

    THE CAVE OF THE UNKNOWN
    BY DANIEL R. COLLINS

    and:

    Adventure Module BF1
    Morgansfort
    The Western Lands Campaign
    A Basic Fantasy Role-Playing Game Campaign
    For 2 to 8 Beginning Player Characters
    Copyright 2006-2008 Chris Gonnerman
    with Nicholas Plant, Chuck Schoonover, Mark Goss, and Greg Schabert
    All Rights Reserved
    Distributed under the terms of the Open Game License version 1.0a
    1st Edition (Release 16)

    I haven't played them, but they look cool. I still have the version my friend at the time made when we were about 12 years old. It's silly, but it's cool at the same time (he designed it to be silly on purpose so it works for me). Let me know if you want me to scan it and post it somewhere (though we did it with the Basic rules at the time and these others aren't straight up Basic but more of an AD&D version). I posted this message here because Return to the Keep on the Borderlands is supposed to be 2nd Edition.
    Master Greytalker

    Joined: May 12, 2005
    Posts: 849
    From: Woonsocket, RI, USA

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    Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:07 pm  

    RttKotB clumsily retrofit Quasqueton (from B1) into the Caves of the Unknown, though the entrance tunnel is completely caved in.
    Adept Greytalker

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    Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:35 am  
    Blah!

    Arg. That's silly. I remember when I had first gotten B1 and B2 and was confused about if the Cave of the Unknown was supposed to be B1 and then I figured out that it wasn't...and ahh, everything was better.

    In Mystara, the Expert book even recommends where to place each of the first B modules. B1 and B2 are not that close.
    Adept Greytalker

    Joined: May 14, 2002
    Posts: 429
    From: Renton WA

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    Thu Aug 20, 2009 5:52 pm  

    return to the keep was pretty piss poor as far as a greyhawk product goes anyway... it was like the only greyhawk products that the author had ever read were gargoyle and puppets, and was somehow confused and thought that the known world was part of greyhawk.

    some parts of the adventure are salvageable (although much of that is poorly designed as well), but as for as greyhawk content the module is worth about as much as toilet paper.
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Jun 09, 2005
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    Sat Oct 03, 2009 6:59 pm  

    cwslyclgh wrote:
    some parts of the adventure are salvageable (although much of that is poorly designed as well), but as for as greyhawk content the module is worth about as much as toilet paper.


    Russ Taylor put together a pretty nice document that fixes some of the canon issues and tweaks some of the 2e game balance issues, you can get it on his site:

    http://www.cmc.net/~rtaylor/greyhawk/

    Click the "Repair of the Keep on the Borderlands" link.
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    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Mon Apr 26, 2010 5:46 am  

    cwslyclgh wrote:
    return to the keep was pretty piss poor as far as a greyhawk product goes anyway... it was like the only greyhawk products that the author had ever read were gargoyle and puppets, and was somehow confused and thought that the known world was part of greyhawk.


    By calling it piss poor I think you re being overly genorous the whole retrun to (borderlands,plume,tomb,giants) run was just god awful I think that someone else should by tsr and wotc should stick to making sub standard card games.
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    GreySage

    Joined: Jul 26, 2010
    Posts: 2489
    From: LG Dyvers

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    Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:56 am  

    I did my own 2e update of Keep on the Borderlands, but it isn't available for download.

    The most important decision I made, I think, was to place it on the Darlene Map of Greyhawk in the northern Vesve forest in one of the hexes covered by the word "Deep", as in Deepstil River. This position works incredibly well for all of the following reasons:

    1) The player characters generally represent a wide variety of races and classes and choose for their characters to have originated in many different parts of the Flaness. It is reasonable to say that they all eventually wandered into Highfolk, then travelled up the valley and east along the river road until arriving at the Keep where they begin their adventuring careers as a party.

    2) The area has a perfect river surrounded by forests.

    3) Iuz (pre- or post-Greyhawk Wars) is a perfect explanation for why the caves of Chaos are inhabited by such an eclectic collection of humaniod tribes and evil Clerics.

    Background that explains much in my WoG version of The Keep on the Borderlands:

    Lord Dread Locks was the second son of a minor Perrenlander lord. He became a successful adventurer and wanted a desmense of his own. With his own funds and the blessing of the ruler of Perrenland, Lord Locks built the Keep on the north side of the Deepstil River - land the Wood Elves do not claim as their own. He claims rulership of the land in a 15 mile radius, north of the river only, centered on the Keep. (All the land north of the river is unclaimed, though the Wolf Nomads, Wood Elves, Iuz, Perrenland, and Highfolk all make use of its resources and have other interests within the area.)

    The Caves of Chaos have an ancient curse on them that causes their location to be forgotten if that person doesn't visit the site once every month. Maps and other written descriptions of it's location fade until disappearing within a month as well. During Lord Locks' rule, the Caves were cleared of monsters and patrolled regularly. Recently, however, Lord Locks has departed the Keep with several of his Henchmen, most of the Keep's cavalry, and many mercenaries to engage the forces of Iuz to the east of his domain. His remaining Henchmen (Tornamir - the Castellan; Abdiel - the Priest of Heironeous; Figolwren - the Elven F3/W3; and Gelinjay - the Gnome Scribe C2) haven't the resources to maintain such constant patrols and have thus lost the location of the Caves of Chaos. They are thrilled to have the PC party hunting monsters in the area. Iuz's forces have managed to slip some small groups of evil humaniods and Priests past the forces of Lord Locks and they have established themselves in the Caves.

    Well, that's more than needed, but it shows how I've incorporated B2 Keep on the Borderlands into the World of Greyhawk. Hope it helps you. :)

    SirXaris
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    Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:47 am  

    Originally both the keep and B1 were placed in Greyhawk. The keep was in the Yeomanry I think and Quasqeton was in the Rakers on the pale border. Both of these came out before The second basic and the expert sets came around and therefore predated Mystara by quite a few years.
    GreySage

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    From: LG Dyvers

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    Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:09 am  

    vonbek wrote:
    Originally both the keep and B1 were placed in Greyhawk. The keep was in the Yeomanry I think and Quasqeton was in the Rakers on the pale border. Both of these came out before The second basic and the expert sets came around and therefore predated Mystara by quite a few years.


    I've seen it placed in the region of Calbut, Tenh as well, but I like my choice best. :)

    SirXaris
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    Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:38 am  

    That's what is best about Greyhawk. You can do what you want with it as it isn't over developed like Forgotten realms. The realms never made any sense as there was no consistency to the setting. Whereas Greyhawk doesn't have as much development so you can tailor it to your own needs and make it as Fantastical or realistic as you want.
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