Signup
Welcome to... Canonfire! World of GreyhawK
Features
Postcards from the Flanaess
Adventures
in Greyhawk
Cities of
Oerth
Deadly
Denizens
Jason Zavoda Presents
The Gord Novels
Greyhawk Wiki
#greytalk
JOIN THE CHAT
ON DISCORD
    Canonfire :: View topic - Aerdy heraldry
    Canonfire Forum Index -> World of Greyhawk Discussion
    Aerdy heraldry
    Author Message
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:28 pm  
    Aerdy heraldry

    Here are some Aerdy heraldry I have made for my maps.



    Bigger image available here: http://ghmaps.net/heraldry/Ahlissashields2.jpg
    Some of the shields are established canon: Rel Mord, Ahlissa
    Some I have suggested new uses for: Pitchfield.
    Some of them are LG triad creations: Innspa and Adri.
    My own creations are: Rel Deven, Marchland of Rauxes,chathold and Grandwood forest and Kalstrand

    From what I have been able to deduct did the old Great Kingdom heraldry carried the following noble house colors which I have based my designs on:
    Blue: Naelax
    Green: Darmen
    Black: Cranden
    House of Almor: Red

    What of Garaseth and Torquann?

    Rauxes have the symbol from the cover of "Ivid the Undying" I played with the assumption it was Ivid's personal symbol and added it on a black background since it is now a Cranden who administer the area. The upper part is stating it is under the rule of the Darmen's of Kalstrand who now runs the United Kingdom of Ahlissa.

    Chathold is a Rel Deven shield with a lower part showing a variant of the old Almorian sheild.

    Grandwood is a version of the Adri with the Darmen colors to show the fact it is wholly claimed by the house of Darmen. The Marchland of the Adri is under the new Ahlissa but administered by a Naelax therefore the blue base.

    The North Kingdom have retained a red base on its shield for traditions I take it since it is ruled by the Naelax.

    I want feedback on what I have done so far and ideas for the shields of the other principalities of both Ahlissa and the North Kingdom.

    So now the expert input of our heraldry gurus like Saracenus and all you other experts are most welcome ;)

    Anna
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 10, 2003
    Posts: 1234
    From: New Jersey

    Send private message
    Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:00 pm  

    Anna,

    First maps now Heraldry. Will your talents ever cease to impress me!

    I think not!

    Later

    Argon
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 07, 2004
    Posts: 1844
    From: Mt. Smolderac

    Send private message
    Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:14 pm  

    Great stuff, Anna! Very nice! I especially like the Marchland of Rauxes. One thing I've always wondered; what's the deal with the grenades on Ahlissa's old arms? Maybe we should start a thread to get people to come up with ideas and explanations for the different arms in GH.
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
    Posts: 2782
    From: South-Central Pennsylvania

    Send private message
    Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:10 am  

    Anna,

    What can I say? Absolutely awesome. You never fail to amaze and impress us, 'Lady of Greyhawk.'

    Well done.

    _________________
    Mystic's web page: http://melkot.com/mysticscholar/index.html
    Mystic's blog page: http://mysticscholar.blogspot.com/
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:37 pm  

    Thanks!

    I saw now that as usual I can't spell and made a typo in the topic of this thread..lol

    The three "whatever they are" in the old Ahlissan heraldry, gave rise to some interesting theories in my Facebook group.

    Bombs or grenades where among the things suggested. My favorite where "Greek fire".

    My next heraldry to try and get right are the Principalities of Jalpa, Torrich and Nulbish.

    Anna
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3811
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:14 am  

    If you have descriptions of any heraldry, I can double check the arrangements for you.

    Also, the Rel Deven heraldry is the same as that for the Knight Protectors, minus the red arrow and white axe on the sides. Was that on purpose?
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Mon Sep 12, 2011 12:29 pm  

    I don't haven't found any descriptions so I'm trying to invent something that would be appropriate.

    The Rel Deven shield is on purpose that way. My thoughts for that were the Crandens sat on the throne at the time and there house symbol were the base for many of the other heraldry at the time like the Knight Protectors of the day. The Naelax changed some or most of it during their reign as the Darmen's have done more recently.

    This is my suggestion for the Principality of Jalpa:



    It is based on the Darmen sheild with a city symbol. I choose it because I get the sense reading about Jalpa that it is a very old city that was once grand and important. Perhaps the first big city in Darmen land.

    If you look closely the symbol resembles the City of Greyhawk, it is not a coincidence. The CoG was founded as a part of the Great Kingdom and they might have "stolen" a symbol of one of the mightiest cities of its time.

    When I study the heraldry of Nyrond and other parts related to the house of Rax-Nyrond I often see orange. Perhaps that was the color originally related to that house. They also have the Red of Almor in their shield.

    Anna
    Paladin

    Joined: Sep 07, 2011
    Posts: 833
    From: Houston Texas

    Send private message
    Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:28 pm  

    Argon wrote:
    Anna,

    First maps now Heraldry. Will your talents ever cease to impress me!


    Hozza & Second That Argon. The Ladies' talents know no bounds!
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3811
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:43 pm  

    The Jalpa field is identical to that of Ahlissa. Better to be different in my opinion, as heraldry is intended to differentiate things visually.
    Also, a city wouldn't bear royal heraldry unless it was the seat of the royal family. I'm not up on my Great Kingdom history, but if Rel Deven is the seat of the Cranden family then it would be appropriate. If not, then no. The heraldry might include a sun, and many of them do, but not a crowned sun, as that denotes a seat of royalty. The form of the crown would also be important as well. Only the royal heraldry would get the "big crown",with lesser royalty having simpler crowns or coronets. Sometimes heraldry is based on rank or familial relation(which is where heraldry will ofttimes be similar), but is is usually about differentiation, and it is intentional that a region's heraldry is not to be very similar among the region itself, its cities, and the organizations within it(particularly if such organizations have military background, like a knightly order does). This applies not only to any devices used, but in particular to the field; i.e. the base colors by which heraldry is able to be identified from a distance, as on a battle field. And imagine the sports teams! It's the green and yellow stripes of Ahlissa versus the yellow and green stripes of Jalpa! You gotta know who to root for. Laughing
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -


    Last edited by Cebrion on Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 14, 2008
    Posts: 222
    From: Modena, Italy

    Send private message
    Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:45 am  

    Just for historical reasons... what about House Rax?
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Sat Sep 17, 2011 3:24 pm  

    Thanks for your confidence in my talents Smile

    You have a good point about the need to be different Cebrion, I'll try and make a better design without the crown. I'll remove it from some of the other shields as well, but not Rel Deven since that is seem to be the seat of the Cranden's.

    I'll have anew go and post my next try soon!

    the House of Almor was part of Rax-Nyrond if I remember correctly and therefore display the red color with the Aerdy star in its emblem. The same symbol used by other Aerdy lands. Almor itself as appropriate and Innspa which has been part of both Almor and Nyrond. But the newly formed North Kingdom has kept the old North Province symbol with crowned red Aerdy star as a base. So it is an interesting topic with more to consider and research.

    Anna
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
    Posts: 2782
    From: South-Central Pennsylvania

    Send private message
    Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:46 pm  

    Well, you're certainly doing your research. No one can fault you for that! Happy

    And now I'm thinking we need to add a Heraldry Page to Canonfire! along with the planned Poetry Page. Shocked

    Yep! Plenty to do! Evil Grin

    Keep 'em coming, Anna! Cool
    _________________
    Mystic's web page: http://melkot.com/mysticscholar/index.html
    Mystic's blog page: http://mysticscholar.blogspot.com/
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Tue Sep 27, 2011 8:17 pm  

    Thanks O mighty Mystic-Scholar Smile

    Here is a set of new proposals for the Jalpa shield:



    I have tried traditional Aerdy designs in the Darmen colors. If none of these are good I'll try and be more creative. In the mean time I'll try and come up with something for Torrich and the ones up north.

    Anna
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3811
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:58 pm  

    If the colors have to be similar, I would go with options 2 or 4, the lack of yellow on the fields being the most important distinctions.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
    Posts: 2782
    From: South-Central Pennsylvania

    Send private message
    Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:36 am  

    If it's to be between numbers 2 and 4, then I vote for number 2.

    (Yes, I know the "pun" you're thinking of!) Evil Grin Laughing


    I still vote the . . . second shield. Wink
    _________________
    Mystic's web page: http://melkot.com/mysticscholar/index.html
    Mystic's blog page: http://mysticscholar.blogspot.com/
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 298
    From: Ahlissa

    Send private message
    Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:52 am  

    Great!
    It is my Favorite too. I'll go with it, thank you.

    Anna
    Display posts from previous:   
       Canonfire Forum Index -> World of Greyhawk Discussion All times are GMT - 8 Hours
    Page 1 of 1

    Jump to:  

    You cannot post new topics in this forum
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum
    You cannot edit your posts in this forum
    You cannot delete your posts in this forum
    You cannot vote in polls in this forum




    Canonfire! is a production of the Thursday Group in assocation with GREYtalk and Canonfire! Enterprises

    Contact the Webmaster.  Long Live Spidasa!


    Greyhawk Gothic Font by Darlene Pekul is used under the Creative Commons License.

    PHP-Nuke Copyright © 2005 by Francisco Burzi. This is free software, and you may redistribute it under the GPL. PHP-Nuke comes with absolutely no warranty, for details, see the license.
    Page Generation: 0.45 Seconds