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Fireplaces

 
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jamesdglick
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Joined: Jul 09, 2003
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Location: Clarksville, TN

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:42 pm    Post subject: Fireplaces Reply with quote

I was looking through the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook. Most of the building sections don't seem to allow for a fireplace and chimney. Fireplaces were fairly basic tech' by the Fourteenth Century, so it should be no biggie. Is there any official rule for this? If not, I'll just go with 30gp.
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SirXaris
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Believe it or not, most castles/manors only had a few fireplaces in them. Most of the rooms were heated with braziers filled with burning coals from the few fireplaces within the building. The kitchen, of course had a fireplace and so did the great hall, but few other rooms had such a luxury.

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jamesdglick
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SirXaris wrote:
Believe it or not, most castles/manors only had a few fireplaces in them...


-In the early Middle Ages, yeah, but by the 1440s (my assumed tech level for the 570s CY), they were starting to become more common (not that they were the most efficient things. Besides, by the fantasy GH/D&D standard, they're even more common than they actually were qv the Welcome Wench in Hommlet, everything in Keep on the Borderlands.

EDIT: Which sort of brings us to the Medieval vs. Fantasy Pseudo-Medieval issue, which we've discussed now and then. One word: Gunpowder! Evil Grin
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Mystic-Scholar
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me see if I understand this correctly: I'm the only fifth generation Bricklayer on the site and you guys are discussing the building and costs of fireplaces without me? Surprised

Figures. Laughing

I believe most of the gaming material suggest more than 30 gp in cost. The DMG, page 101, states that a "simple house" will cost 1000 gp. There is a chart that outlines the daily salaries of craftsmen on page 105.

To build the fireplace will take one master mason, two apprentices and three or four laborers. And the building materials and conditions of the time period we're discussing means that it will take them approximately three weeks to build it.

And that's if all the materials are close at hand. Remember, they couldn't phone up, order the building materials and then have them delivered.

And no gunpowder! Razz
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jamesdglick
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fireplace



Chimneys were invented in northern Europe in the 11th or 12th centuries and largely fixed the problem of fumes, more reliably venting smoke outside. They made it possible to give the fireplace a draft, and also made it possible to put fireplaces in multiple rooms in buildings conveniently. They did not come into general use immediately, however, as they were expensive to build and maintain.

In 1678 Prince Rupert, nephew of Charles I, raised the grate of the fireplace, improving the airflow and venting system. The 18th century saw two important developments in the history of fireplaces. Benjamin Franklin developed a convection chamber for the fireplace that greatly improved the efficiency of fireplaces and wood stoves. He also improved the airflow by pulling air from a basement and venting out a longer area at the top. In the later 18th century, Count Rumford designed a fireplace with a tall, shallow firebox that was better at drawing the smoke up and out of the building. The shallow design also improved greatly the amount of radiant heat projected into the room. Rumford's design is the foundation for modern fireplaces.
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Mystic-Scholar
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jamesdglick wrote:
Chimneys were invented in northern Europe in the 11th or 12th centuries and largely fixed the problem of fumes, more reliably venting smoke outside.


Allow me to correct this one point; because the people that write those articles are not bricklayers.

It wasn't the chimney that worked at "fixing the problem of fumes," it was, specifically, the invention of the throat. It is that portion of the chimney just above the firebox and just behind the damper -- that is called "the throat" -- which causes the upward draft.

Primitive chimneys have existed for quite some time. They are simply the means by which the fumes and smoke exit the room, or building. You could stick your head into the fireplace (firebox), look up and see sky., rain got in, as well as birds and other . . . varmints.
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