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    Canonfire :: View topic - Questions about From the Ashes
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    Questions about From the Ashes
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    Novice

    Joined: Sep 21, 2019
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    Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:31 pm  
    Questions about From the Ashes

    Long time lurker here, first time question.

    Does anyone remember a mini adventure where the PCs are protecting a Scarlet Brotherhood delegation around the signing of the Pact of Greyhawk?
    I believe it was on a reference card, which I have lost some time ago.

    Also, has anyone actually DMéd the attack by Rary at the signing?

    I am thinking of having my PCs there as it happens, as they played a significant role in the war, and I'd like them to be there for the ceremony?

    I would love to know what other DM's did with this.

    Thanks very much, in advance.
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 11, 2009
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    Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:12 pm  

    I think the mini adventure you're talking about was one of the adventure cards from the City of Greyhawk boxed set.

    Interesting question about running the fight between Rary, Tenser, and Otiluke at the signing. If I remember correctly the magical battle totally destroyed the building and several adjacent buildings as well. If your PCs were there, it would be hard for them to survive in the middle of a battle of 3 legendary wizards. Unless they ran as soon as Meteor Swarms started flying....
    Novice

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    Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:49 pm  

    Thanks, yes it is in the boxed set, found it.

    I'm hoping to develop a plot line for the PCs (who are around 16-18th level) in the City with a lead up to the signing.

    I want them to uncover some mid - high level plots by Iuz or the Scarlet Brotherhood to disrupt the peace process. Hopefully lulling them into the a false sense of security when it comes to the signing of the pact, only to have them present when Rary unleashes hell.

    My understanding was that Rary had created a magical trap or true dweomer that he activated in the Great Hall. I will have to do some research.

    But yes, I am hoping to tie it in with A Paladin in Hell as their next adventure (assuming they survive)
    GreySage

    Joined: Jul 26, 2010
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    From: LG Dyvers

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    Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:57 pm  

    Remember, Rary was caught in the act.of setting a trap, or ambush, to destroy the signatories of the various nations involved in the Wars. This would include many high level individuals and their powerful bodyguards. None would be willing to attend unarmed and without their magical protection. If Rary thought he could kill them all, he either had powerful spells ready to be triggered successively, or he had many of his own powerful minions along to help him, or both!

    Note that Robilar should be there for this fight. IIRC Canon states that Robilar was sacking Tenser's castle and Otiluke's residence in Greyhawk City at the same time Rary was fighting those two wizards. That doesn't make much sense. It is much more reasonable for Robilar to have been sent to destroy the clones of those two after he and Rary realized that they had been caught. If Rary didn't foresee his ambush being foiled, it seems illogical that he could have foreseen the need to destroy the clones of the two wizards that ended up ambushing him

    I assume your players are descently high level, if they survived adventuring through the Greyhawk Wars. So, you may have them assigned to guard duty on the location of the signing as it is being prepared, or even have the city leaders task them with it's protection. Wouldn't that be fun! When it is discovered that Rary defeated their protective operations, then defeated them in battle - killing Tender and Otilukr in the process, they just might be higher on everyone's hate list than Rary himself! Razz

    It may be very difficult to DM such a battle, though. If you try to play Tenser and Otiluke along with Rary, Robilar, and their high-powered minions, it could be very slow going. You should probably allow your players to play the NPCs on their side of the battle.
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    Last edited by SirXaris on Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:09 pm; edited 2 times in total
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:18 am  

    Tensersclone wrote:
    Thanks, yes it is in the boxed set, found it.

    I'm hoping to develop a plot line for the PCs (who are around 16-18th level) in the City with a lead up to the signing.

    I want them to uncover some mid - high level plots by Iuz or the Scarlet Brotherhood to disrupt the peace process. Hopefully lulling them into the a false sense of security when it comes to the signing of the pact, only to have them present when Rary unleashes hell.

    My understanding was that Rary had created a magical trap or true dweomer that he activated in the Great Hall. I will have to do some research.

    But yes, I am hoping to tie it in with A Paladin in Hell as their next adventure (assuming they survive)


    Ok, this definitely sounds promising. PCs of that level could interact more closely and/or work directly with members of the CoE, although running combat with that many high level characters will be complex.

    Yes, Rary set up a magical trap and was caught in the act by Tenser and Otiluke, which turned into a full blow battle between the three (it didn't mention any others, but there could have been). I'll be interested in hearing how you tie this into A Paladin in Hell. A Paladin in Hell is one of my top 2 favorite adventures of all time and your PCs will love it. Although PCs of 16-18th level won't last long in APiH. To make it through they will need to be closer to 18-21st level from my experience.
    Novice

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    Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:15 pm  

    thanks chaps, good feedback. and yes, I am looking forward to Paladin in Hell. I have an 18th level Paladin with Holy Avenger in the party and he is an absolute beast.

    A little background on the campaign.

    It has been running for about 14 years, and I am running out of things to do with these guys.

    It has been almost unremittingly a PC's vs Iuz campaign, culminating in them recovering the Crook of Rao in the Isle of the Ape, returning to Tenser's castle, while he left to Veluna in order to set up a ceremony for activating the relic, the PCs weathered an onslaught from a desperate Iuzian force led by several Boneheart members and significant demonic aid.
    Kermin and Null penetrated the castle where they entered Tensers vault , and took what they thought was the Crook of Rao. It turned out to be a ringer, and Tenser had left the PCs to protect it, in order to take Iuz's focus from Mitrik, where he had actually taken the real Crook, and hastily performed the ceremony with Hazen and various other high level NPCs at the same time Tensers castle was being attacked. (the DMing of which, was a nightmare in complexity as you can imagine - totally exhausted by it)

    Tenser returned to see the results of his gambit, which had been successful, although costly both for PCs and his castle guards and much of his castle.
    Having a few mixed feelings about Tensers deception, they remain in good faith with the archmage.

    So we now time jump a few months from there to Greyhawk city, where the PCs are involved with the diplomatic end of the war, having assumed they spent some time on the Nothern front retaking Critwall and breaking the seige of Chendl etc etc.


    They will converge on Greyhawk, and meet the great aging Paladin legend Klysandral (who had been present at the Crooks activation) , who will die shortly afterwards and perhaps even in Rary's attack.

    That's as far as I have schemed ahead.

    Paladin in Hell looks like a brute of a module, I'm encouraged that it is such a favourite of yours XO42.

    Any tips on running it will be gratefully received
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 11, 2009
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    Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:38 am  

    Tensersclone wrote:
    thanks chaps, good feedback. and yes, I am looking forward to Paladin in Hell. I have an 18th level Paladin with Holy Avenger in the party and he is an absolute beast.


    It has been running for about 14 years, and I am running out of things to do with these guys.

    It has been almost unremittingly a PC's vs Iuz campaign, culminating in them recovering the Crook of Rao in the Isle of the Ape, returning to Tenser's castle, while he left to Veluna in order to set up a ceremony for activating the relic, the PCs weathered an onslaught from a desperate Iuzian force led by several Boneheart members and significant demonic aid.
    Kermin and Null penetrated the castle where they entered Tensers vault , and took what they thought was the Crook of Rao. It turned out to be a ringer, and Tenser had left the PCs to protect it, in order to take Iuz's focus from Mitrik, where he had actually taken the real Crook, and hastily performed the ceremony with Hazen and various other high level NPCs at the same time Tensers castle was being attacked. (the DMing of which, was a nightmare in complexity as you can imagine - totally exhausted by it)

    Tenser returned to see the results of his gambit, which had been successful, although costly both for PCs and his castle guards and much of his castle.
    Having a few mixed feelings about Tensers deception, they remain in good faith with the archmage.

    So we now time jump a few months from there to Greyhawk city, where the PCs are involved with the diplomatic end of the war, having assumed they spent some time on the Nothern front retaking Critwall and breaking the seige of Chendl etc etc.


    They will converge on Greyhawk, and meet the great aging Paladin legend Klysandral (who had been present at the Crooks activation) , who will die shortly afterwards and perhaps even in Rary's attack.


    Paladin in Hell looks like a brute of a module, I'm encouraged that it is such a favourite of yours XO42.

    Any tips on running it will be gratefully received


    Your PCs will need the powers of that Paladin and probably two high level wizards to have any chance to survive APIH, but they will love every minute. It's a very long and difficult adventure and their Priests will be significantly weakened while they're in the Abyss, which makes it even harder because you'll need maximum healing spells. There's also limited opportunity to rest and recover spells and the PCs are under a time crunch, so the difficulty (and suspense) continues to increase rapidly. They will also get to fight numerous high powered and iconic enemies, as well as two famous big baddies in Hell.

    Ok, your whole campaign arc sounds amazing and very well put together. I admit, I wish I was one of your PCs playing through it. Using Isle of the Ape as a lead in to a battle in Tenser's castle is a great idea. If you haven't read Return of the Eight you should because it's got some cool details about Tenser's caste and defenses. The battle you set up versus The Boneheart and your PCs sounds epic too. Those kind of battles are difficult to run, but awesome and unforgettable.

    Love your idea on how to incorporate Klysandral with the PCs and it's a great way to lead them into APIH. I'd recommend you look at some of the key battles in APIH and mentally work your way through how you want to run the bad guys against how your PCs fight. I guarantee your PCs actions will surprise you a few times during those fights and it might be hard to adjust later encounters. Even if your PCs do everything right, there are several fights that could be total party kills. You'll have to be prepared to fix things on the fly if necessary and give them an assist here and there. The toughest part for you won't just be running the monsters, it'll be running the environment because the DemonWing is so unique and some of the encounters there and in Hell are very complex. I look forward to hearing how it goes!
    Adept Greytalker

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    Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:25 am  

    Paladin In Hell is a great module, I ran a slightly modified version of it for the showdown in the last campaign I ran and it went down well.

    Depending on how purist you are you might consider allowing the priests and wizards access to power and spell keys introduced in the Planescape setting.
    Novice

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    Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:21 pm  

    Sage advice.
    Does the Paladins circle of power diminish in Hell?
    Please say yes.
    At the moment, the player of the Paladin has negotiated a circle of power that excludes any attacks by a magic user of any level below his (20th), which seems excessive.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 09, 2003
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    Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:23 am  

    SirXaris wrote:
    ..Note that Robilar should be there for this fight...


    -You mean (ahem) Bilarro... Wink Laughing
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
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    Fri Oct 04, 2019 12:54 am  

    Tensersclone wrote:
    Sage advice.
    Does the Paladins circle of power diminish in Hell?
    Please say yes.
    At the moment, the player of the Paladin has negotiated a circle of power that excludes any attacks by a magic user of any level below his (20th), which seems excessive.

    What exactly do you mean by "the Paladin has negotiated a circle of power that excludes any attacks by a magic user of any level below his (20th)"? This is not a standard thing by any means. The paladin's circle of power does not function as a selective anti-magic shell (even in conjunction with wielding a holy avenger). How did the paladin "negotiate" this, considering it is what would be considered to be a deity level power?

    In any event, as the DM, if you can choose the break the...ahem...hell out of an ability in one direction, you surely also can choose to break the Hell out of it in the other. Welcome to Hell Mr. Paladin. Wink
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    Last edited by Cebrion on Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:10 am; edited 1 time in total
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am  

    Get your hands on a copy of Manual of the Planes. It will answer most of your questions relating to what powers and spells operate in the Planes, including those pertaining to paladins!

    -Lanthorn
    Adept Greytalker

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    Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:03 pm  

    Remember Bigby was present at the attack too and initially reported dead (see TSR collector cards and Carl Sargent's errata in Dragon)
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Sat Nov 23, 2019 10:23 am  

    vestcoat wrote:
    Remember Bigby was present at the attack too and initially reported dead (see TSR collector cards and Carl Sargent's errata in Dragon)



    I wasn't tracking that, thanks! Anyone else have any info on this topic?
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