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    Prime Material gods
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    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 30, 2017
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    Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:08 am  
    Prime Material gods

    In the WoGH boxed set and Dragon articles, several gods are specified as living on the Prime Plane; Iuz, Ehlonna, Obad-Hai, Fharlanghn, Wastri, Zagig (Prime/C.O.), and Olidammara.

    Beory's home plane is the Prime. She might be the Oerth in some sense.

    Ehlonna is still listed as a Prime Material goddess in Greyhawk Adventures.
    Fharlanghn has not moved, either.

    I have seen material online that indicates Fharlanghn, Obad Hai, Ehlonna, and Olidammara dwell not on the Prime but on Outer Planes, Is that a Planescape thing? A 3Eism?

    I had thought it must have been shifted in From the Ashes ( a game design choice to empower Iuz by removing obstacles to his conquests?) but I don't see the changes noted when I scroll through my pdf copy of that boxed set. Did I just miss it?


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    GreySage

    Joined: Aug 03, 2001
    Posts: 3083
    From: Michigan

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    Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:43 am  

    It's a Planescape thing. The Planescape sourcebook On Hallowed Ground gave Ehlonna a realm on the Beastlands, Olidammara a realm in Ysgard, and Obad-hai a realm in the Outlands. Beory and Fharlanghn remained solely on the Prime Material Plane. Demigods weren't mentioned.

    3e's Manual of the Planes and Complete Divine followed Planescape's placement.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Tue Oct 29, 2019 12:21 pm  

    Thanks, Rasgon.


    I don't normally use Planescape material. I'll stick to the older stuff for this one.

    It won't likely matter much.
    Adept Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 29, 2006
    Posts: 468
    From: Dantredun, MN

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    Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:18 pm  

    Random fact: Slade Henson moved Iuz to Tartarus in WGS2 and did an entirely new writeup on the demigod without consulting any previous source (Dragon #67, the WoG box, ToEE, or GH Adventures).
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:29 pm  

    vestcoat wrote:
    Random fact: Slade Henson moved Iuz to Tartarus in WGS2 and did an entirely new writeup on the demigod without consulting any previous source (Dragon #67, the WoG box, ToEE, or GH Adventures).


    Moving Iuz to Tarterus isn't a bad idea. It all depends on how big a deal you ant him to be in the Flanaess, and how you see the locations and actions of the other gods.

    If Tarterus becomes Iuz's homeplane, then on Oerth his direct power will be rather more limited.

    But the relocation removes him from Ehlonna's (comparatively close) reach. The other Prime Plane deities are neutrals, mostly, but Ehlonna is NG and has her center of worship (though probably not her deific realm; its whereabouts are not mentioned beyond being on the Prime and presumably the Oerth) right smack in the middle of lands threatened by Iuz.

    Iuz can rule his Oerthly empire through a possessed servant or an avatar.
    GreySage

    Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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    From: Michigan

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    Thu Oct 31, 2019 7:58 pm  

    While Iuz physically dwells on Oerth, Iuz the Evil mentioned that "Iuz has always protected himself with a carefully secreted soul gem hidden on an unknown, unbelievably well-guarded Abyssal plane. He can be killed on the Prime Material, but unless the soul gem is destroyed beforehand, he cannot be destroyed forever."

    I don't think it much matters if the soul gem is in the Abyss or Tartarus; the Abyss seems more appropriate, but Tartarus might make the gem harder for his rivals to find.
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 11, 2009
    Posts: 227
    From: Montgomery, Alabama

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    Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:25 am  

    I don't like Iuz being moved to Tartarus. It doesn't work well for most canon and definitely changes his powers and the dynamic control/focus he as on Oerth. He's only a demigod so his powers and abilities (while still impressive), wouldn't be as powerful on an outer plane as they are in relation to a prime world full of humans and demi humans. I also think his location on Tartarus and it's distance from the prime would severely weaken his priesthood, which again would diminish his scope and power on Oerth.
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Sep 20, 2001
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    Sun Nov 03, 2019 12:51 pm  

    In my campaign, I've kept every deity originally listed dwelling on the Prime as dwelling there, and assumed the Outer Planes residences mentioned later are "summer homes" or such.

    Oerth seems like a very different world with Fharlanghn and Olidammara and Ehlonna wandering around than if the only deity present is Iuz. With other deities present, the only thing that makes Iuz special is that he has created a realm of his own and is actively, personally trying to influence events (as opposed to influence through worshippers alone).

    I loved Gygax's attention to the various ruses and disguises Prime Material deities adopt when encountered; I also think there should be more encounters with the divine in general--not combat or even necessarily epic ones--but things like Olidammara disguised as a toothless old man winning a dragon's hoard of gp from the party at Three Dragon Ante.
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