I recently received a very generous gift of the Gord novels. Previously I'd never read them and thereby missed a significant resource about the Flanaess.
The first book provides many interesting details as well as contradictions to what I believe was established canon. The LGG appears to have incorporated many of the former--perhaps while also resolving some oft the latter. For example, the machinations of the Hierarchs of the Horned Society in the Bandit Kingdoms were one of Gord's adventures (with Gellor) based in Stoink--the so-called City of Wasps. However, other than the existence of Knurl, Count Dunstan, and his beauteous daughter Evaleigh, the LGG appears to reject the idea that Nyrond established Count Dunstan. Instead, the LGG holds that the County Blemu survived the humanoid invasion of Bone March.
Since this is the area where I'm imagining my next campaign (in the years just prior to its invasion/fall), I hope to hear many people's ideas about the Gord novels and the Bone March.
Instead, the LGG holds that the County Blemu survived the humanoid invasion of Bone March.
Since this is the area where I'm imagining my next campaign (in the years just prior to its invasion/fall), I hope to hear many people's ideas about the Gord novels and the Bone March.
I go with the LGG. Knurl, somehow, survived. It probably means that the city is formidably well defended, probably by a combination of terrain and fortification and the calibre of it's defenders. The way I rationalise it is that much of the shattered Bone Marcher forces retreated south in 461 CY and regrouped in Knurl, where with prepared defences and the vicious determination of making a last stand, they repulsed the humanoids. They were probably helped by the fact that the momentum had gone out of the humanoid onslaught at that point, with the invaders turning on each other to claim turf and loot the riches of the March.
The Nyrond connection need not be so mysterious. Once Spinecastle fell and it became clear that no relief would come to the March from either Eastfair or Rauxes, Dunstan would have naturally looked west to Rel Mord for aid in stablising his situation. If that required oaths of fealty to Archbold III, then so be it. Once this was done and he gained a respite from the orcish onslaughts, he had some breathing space for his ambitions of uniting Ratik and a reclaimed Bone March under the rule of the House of Dunstan, an ambition aided only to a point by his suzereinity to Archbold III.
Hey Paul, good to hear from you. I enjoyed your piece on Highport: City of Chains--especially the evocatively named Chainers' Guild. Do you have plans to detail the other cities of the Pomarj--Blue and Stoneheim? In general, how has the Pomarj been treated in LGH?
Regarding your response, will you explain why you prefer the LGG over Gygax's novel? Is this simply a case of following the main LGH reference, or did your own campaigns suggest this. From my recollection of the "In Days of a Splintered Sun" story-posts you once shared, the PCs never ventured to the Bone March. Was the survival of Knurl part of the campaign backstory for the Company of the Flute?
I greatly enjoy your suggestion "that much of the shattered Bone Marcher forces retreated south in 461 CY and regrouped in Knurl, where with prepared defences and the vicious determination of making a last stand, they repulsed the humanoids." I'll definitely incorporate it although I remain undecided as to the success of the defense. Perhaps it would have failed but for the intervention of the Gnomeking, whose forces need not have been intended to liberate Knurl but instead simply might have been a counter-attack intended to notify the humanoids to ware the Flinty Hills(?).
Previously I'd focused on the Teesar Torrent and imagined troops from the Highlander Castles disobeying the Herzog's orders not to cross the river. Under their Baron-General, the troops forded the river and disrupted the gnolls and whatnot that sought to slaughter the routed Bone Marchers. In this version, which could be complementary to yours, a significant number of refugees and soldiery escaped the slaughter and found a new home in Redfalls Barony.
Have you incorporated Shalaster into either LGH or your home campaigns?
Glad to see you (and your torrent of questions!) again on the Greyhawk forums!
mtg wrote:
Do you have plans to detail the other cities of the Pomarj--Blue and Stoneheim? In general, how has the Pomarj been treated in LGH?
There's no plans to detail any of the other cities of the Pomarj in the Mysterious Places column. Highport was featured to tie in with a Core module premiering at GC Indy this week. I've been trying (with varying success) to make the MP columns tie in with Core, Metaregional or Regional module releases to make them useful and relevent to LG DMs and players. I can tell you that future MPs this year will feature Kalstrand, Scant and the Duchy of Berghof.
mtg wrote:
Regarding your response, will you explain why you prefer the LGG over Gygax's novel? Is this simply a case of following the main LGH reference, or did your own campaigns suggest this.
Following the main LGH reference and trying to smooth out the turbulance between canon sources.
mtg wrote:
Was the survival of Knurl part of the campaign backstory for the Company of the Flute?
Nope - I think Knurl got it (it being an infestation of humanoids) in 461 CY in our home campaign.
mtg wrote:
Perhaps it would have failed but for the intervention of the Gnomeking, whose forces need not have been intended to liberate Knurl but instead simply might have been a counter-attack intended to notify the humanoids to ware the Flinty Hills(?).
That's quite plausible. It'd suit the Gnomeking to have Knurl as something of a buffer (or at least an alternate focus) against the humanoids. He'd also be mindful of the fate of his kinfolk in the Blemu Hills.
mtg wrote:
Previously I'd focused on the Teesar Torrent and imagined troops from the Highlander Castles disobeying the Herzog's orders not to cross the river. Under their Baron-General, the troops forded the river and disrupted the gnolls and whatnot that sought to slaughter the routed Bone Marchers. In this version, which could be complementary to yours, a significant number of refugees and soldiery escaped the slaughter and found a new home in Redfalls Barony.
Have you incorporated Shalaster into either LGH or your home campaigns?
Can't recall if Shalaster would have been on the Tessar in 561 CY. I always imagined him as arriving there after the fall of the March. The principality of Highlander would certainly have been a post NK foundation.
Shalaster hasn't appeared in The Mighty Fallen (home campaign), nor has he featured largely in LGH, which hasn't really focussed that much on the NK.
First, I invite all CF! posters to join this thread. While my original question may have been obscure, all GH fans are welcome to join this sharing of arcane ideas.
Second, I agree with the Woesinger that Baron-General Shalaster likely changed his demesne to that of the (future) Highlander Principality after the fall of the Bone March. However, recall that the march's fall occurred over a series of years. First the humanoid raids increased. Then, Spinecastle was betrayed ... in CY 563.
Shalaster may have changed his allegiance while the Bone March was being invaded. As I write this, I think that it is the way I will go IMC because I think that the later-called Highlander Principality benefits from Shalaster's Barony Redfalls having been established as an attempt to recapture the then-lost days of Aerdi-greatness.
While the Baron-General is aligned LE as of CY 584/5 (according to Sargent), I've long imagined that he (and others) desire to recapture the glory of the Great Kingdom.
Well, it's possible that Shalaster moved up to the Highlander castles in 563, but given he was 39 in 585, he'd have been 17 at the time. That's not beyond the realm of possibility given that medieval nobles tended to grow up early (see Rob Stark in GRR Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series), but I'd have thought he'd at least have had to be of age (perhaps 18) to be able to legally exchange his fief.
Also supporting Shalaster heading north as a youth is the line:
Quote:
...the princling grew into an exceptionally strong youth and exchanged his landholdings south of Rinloru for those of a Torquann noble east of Knurl and across the Tessar.
The implication is that he went north pretty early in life. The coincidence of the fall of Spinecastle the year before is as good a reason as any that a young strapping lad with a taste for war would need to get away from his relatives and move to that particular location. Makes a lot of sense in fact.
It's clear though, that Shalaster was appointed leader of the Imperial Highlanders after the Wars, since he is referred to in Ivid the Undying as their "new leader".
As to his ambitions, there's nothing inconsistant between being LE and wanting the old glories of the Great Kingdom to be restored. Followers of Hextor and LE generals and nobles are no less responsible for many of the conquests of Aerdy than Heironians or LG warriors and generals such as Azharadian. The North Province was conquered by the Naelax and the Torquann, who always seemed to have dark streak to them.
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