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    Canonfire :: View topic - Please help me with weather
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    Please help me with weather
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    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 21, 2010
    Posts: 196


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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:21 am  
    Please help me with weather

    Right now it's Needfest 592 in the March of Sterich. I'd like your help to define the temperature and general weather conditions.
    So far I've kept the early winter (Sunsebb) as a bit dry with the average of +8 C. Average temp at nights have been +1 C.
    I was thinking that Sheldomar's Needfest would not have any snow and the average temperature might be +6 C (-1 C during nights).

    What do you think? Canon-weather anyone?

    Edit: Just for reference: http://www.madrid-tourist-guide.com/en/weather/weather-madrid.html
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3807
    From: So. Cal

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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:41 am  

    If you want to go by real world estimates, find an area on the globe at 30 degrees north latitude, and see what the weather is like there around Needfest time(the end of the year). It is close to that time now, and Austin, Texas is just above 30 degree north latitude(Cairo, Egypt is almost smack dab on it). Seeing as the environment in Sterich is more like Texas than Egypt, I would go with the Austin weather report for New Year's Eve(12/31/11) or so.

    I am pretty sure somebody has done up a weather article/program for Greyhawk though. Ah, yes. Here it is, right in this section, third offering.

    Blessed be our crazy Greyhawk fans who make stuff like this, and share it with us. Laughing Cool
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    Paladin

    Joined: Sep 07, 2011
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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:47 am  

    Simplistic compares would place Needfest to the end of year (dec) in our world. and using the WoG map, Sterich is on roughly 29 degrees latitude. So you could use our own norms for that latitude, or you can utilize the Glossography that was with the original box set for the WoG.
    The next step would be latitude on the WoG map, The Glossography that was attached to the original WOG had tables for the flaness on pages 18 thru 25. Based on those tables, With Chendl as a base( it is approximately on the 40th parallel latitude which is what the base chart is set up from), 16 hexes west and 27 hexes south of that locale would be Istivin (capital of Sterich).
    each 2 1/3 hexes equal +2 degrees F (or simplified, +6 degrees for every 7 hexes south) in this case almost +24 degrees F on the base temp. So for Sterich in Fireseek (Jan) would give a base of 56F +d10 for a High and 56F -d20 for a low using those charts. Note would still have to allow for terrain too '( ie mountains, swamp, etc)
    And as Big C has chimed in... the weather generator here is a good tool to frame in an annual weather for an area as a guide.
    GreySage

    Joined: Jul 26, 2010
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    From: LG Dyvers

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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:20 am  

    Another consideration you should take into account is that the weather patterns across the Flanaess generally travel from the east to the west, which is opposite to that of real earth in the norther hemisphere from 30 to 60 degrees north longitude.

    That means that the prevailing winds travel across the Azure Sea and over the Sheldamar Valley before hitting Sterich. They then run right into the Crystalmists and drop their rain as they cool while rising over the heights. By the time they cross over the mountains, the air has lost its moisture and sucks up any moisture it comes across as it warms while decending back to Oerth on the west side of the Crystalmists.

    Therefore, Sterich should have a climate very similar to the California Valley, though perhaps a bit warmer even.

    SirXaris
    GreySage

    Joined: Jul 26, 2010
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    From: LG Dyvers

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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:20 am  

    Another consideration you should take into account is that the weather patterns across the Flanaess generally travel from the east to the west, which is opposite to that of real earth in the norther hemisphere from 30 to 60 degrees north longitude.

    That means that the prevailing winds travel across the Azure Sea and over the Sheldamar Valley before hitting Sterich. They then run right into the Crystalmists and drop their rain as they cool while rising over the heights. By the time they cross over the mountains, the air has lost its moisture and sucks up any moisture it comes across as it warms while decending back to Oerth on the west side of the Crystalmists.

    Therefore, Sterich should have a climate very similar to the California Valley, though perhaps a bit warmer even.

    SirXaris
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Feb 01, 2005
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    From: Columbus, Ohio

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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:53 am  

    I too run a campaign set in Sterich. I created my own gazetteer based on any and all snippets I could find here and on the web.

    I agree that the weather is much like central to northern California. Here's what I came up with after visiting a site about the meteorological data of said area. Of course, I tweaked it for taste and available Greyhawk data.

    I hope it helps

    Weather in the March of Sterich


    Month (+festival) Low High Precipitation
    Sunsebb (NF) 35F 55F 0.00 in.
    Fireseek 40F 60F 0.25 in.
    Readying 45F 65F 0.50 in.
    Coldeven (GF) 45F 70F 1.00 in
    Planting 50F 80F 2.00 in..
    Flocktime 55 F 85F 2.50 in.
    Wealsun (RF) 60F 90F 3.75 in
    Reaping 60F 95F 3.50 in
    Goodmonth 55F 90F 2.75 in
    Harvester (BF) 50F 80F 1.00 in.
    Patchwall 45F 60F 0.50 in.
    Readyreat 40F 50F 0.25 in

    The numbers above represent averages. Temperatures can vary as much as 16F.

    Roll 1d6: Non-summer months Summer months
    result of 1 (-) 3d6-2F (-) 2d6-1F
    result of 2 (-) 2d6-1F (-) 1d6F
    result of 3 average low or high average low or high
    result of 4 average low or high average low or high
    result of 5 (+) 1d6F (+) 2d6-1F
    result of 6 (+) 2d6-1F (+) 3d6-2F


    WINDS The winds and thus the weather of the Flanaess and Sheldomar Valley move from east to west. The eastern sides of mountains receive rain from the clouds forced over them, while the western sides are made arid by the descending air. Winds from the southeast during spring and summer bring storms and rain to the valley. The Jotens and the Good Hills conspire to deprive the air of moisture before it reaches the Sterich Valley. Unlike other areas of the Sheldomar, Sterich has a temperate climate not a sub-tropical one.

    PRECIPITATION Annual precipitation totals in excess of 50 inches per year are characteristic of Sterich.

    THUNDERSTORMS Thunderstorms may occur in Sterich at any time of the year. The storms are usually light and infrequent. Over the Jotens storms are more intense. In these mountain areas, thunderstorms average 50 to 60 days per year. They usually occur when cool, moist air moves in to break a prolonged hot spell. Some flash flooding has been reported as a result of thunderstorms. Hail up to one-half inch in diameter is sometimes reported, but serious hail damage is infrequent.

    SNOWFALL Snow has been reported at one time or another in nearly every part of the March, but it is very infrequent. In the Jotens, snow in moderate amounts is reported nearly every winter at elevations as low as 2,000 feet. Above 4,000 feet elevation snow remains on the ground for appreciable lengths of time each winter.

    GROWING SEASON The valleys has a freeze-free season of 240 days. The agricultural area within the low country reports a growing season of 160 days long.

    TORNADOES Tornadoes have been reported in Sterich, but with a frequency of only two or four per year usually occurring in the summer months. They are generally not severe, in many cases amounting to little more than damage to trees or light buildings.

    RELATIVE HUMIDITY In general, relative humidities are moderate during the summer and slightly lower during the winter. Due to the distance from the ocean and intervening mountains, relative humidity tends to be somewhat low.

    FLOODS Flooding rarely occurs in Sterich, but near the Davish headwaters it is a fairly common occurrence.
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

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    Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:33 pm  

    Greetings,

    Ironic. I had thought to post something about weather for the past few weeks, so I am glad someone did it for me. :)

    I have long grappled with weather generation, but find it extremely interesting and important, especially for outdoor campaigns (which are often my favorite).

    I will admit that the weather system generator from WoG baffles me somewhat, mainly with respect to the latitude chart. The rest of the information is easy enough, thorough, and very useful.

    However, if you have access to the Wilderness Survival Guide (hardback, and a GREAT resource), you can use the charts and tables given therein. I myself use a hybridized version of the WoG weather tables with the weather table from this tome. You can cross-reference the approximate latitude of Sterich (or any place) to the chart given in that book (to determine if it is a temperate zone, etc) and determine the type of ecosystem appropriate to that region (forest, hills, etc) for the range of temperatures possible.

    I typically roll up weeks of weather in advance if I anticipate a long outdoor campaign, as well as any potential random encounters. I enjoy the fact that I am 'ready to go' and don't have to take time out of game figuring these variables.

    best o' luck,

    -Lanthorn
    Paladin

    Joined: Sep 07, 2011
    Posts: 833
    From: Houston Texas

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    Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:03 am  

    Lanthorn wrote:
    Greetings,

    Ironic. I had thought to post something about weather for the past few weeks, so I am glad someone did it for me. :)

    However, if you have access to the Wilderness Survival Guide (hardback, and a GREAT resource),

    As Lanthorn says, I too have been thinking on this (as Azzie and I have been working on a Glossography / almanac update), but had forgotten about the survival guide.... that was a good one, have to dig it back out! Thanks Lanthorn for the mental reminder. Was making a list of towns / cities by longitude & latitude would be good to blend (as you did) the info from WSG. With that said, anyone seen anything defining temperate zone types for the flaness? Could use the map as defined by hex, but that will be pretty cumbersome.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 07, 2004
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    From: Mt. Smolderac

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    Fri Dec 02, 2011 2:04 pm  

    Another thing to consider is the elevation of Sterich (and other places) and how that will affect temperature. I think of Sterich's obviously flatter parts as gaining in elevation the further west you go, which could give it somewhat cooler temperatures. This isn't canon, obviously, just my take on it based on what I know about Sterich.
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
    Posts: 2781
    From: South-Central Pennsylvania

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    Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:39 pm  

    smillan_31 wrote:
    Another thing to consider is the elevation of Sterich . . .


    So what's Sterich's elevation?

    The state of Wyoming appears flat, but it averages between 5,000 and 7,000 feet above sea level.

    It's much the same in Arizona. Flagstaff is almost 7,000 feet above sea level, but it appears "flat" ( a slight incline) as you approach the city in a motor vehicle.

    Sterich could be "flat," but at the same time, be several thousand feet above sea level, so . . .

    Here comes the snow! And plenty of it! Evil Grin
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    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:08 am  

    Friends,

    Are elevations even given on the maps at all??? As far as I know, only latitudes and longitudes could be calculated, but nowhere that I have seen that offers elevations to specific regions. Someone please correct me if I am wrong!

    DLG, according to the Wilderness Survival Guide, here are the breakdowns for latitudes and climates:

    1) Arctic: 90-66 degrees: nothing on the maps qualifies for this extreme

    2) Subarctic: 65-51 degrees: this runs to just about the capital of Yecha to Eru-Tovar (west map)

    3) Temperate: 50-31 degrees: south of the aforementioned areas to roughly the southern fringes of the Stark Mounds and Highport of the Pomarj (west map)

    4) Subtropical: 30-16 degrees: from the regions mentioned above to roughly halfway through the large lake in the Amedio Jungle (west map)

    Hope that helps,

    -Lanthorn, of the Traveling Summoner
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 07, 2004
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    From: Mt. Smolderac

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    Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:44 am  

    No. No elevations given. My post was more of a suggestion, as in, "Well, Sterich is a big valley almost entirely surrounded by mountains and hills with it's main river being shallow, very cold and swiftly running, so feel free to just say it's at a higher elevation if you want it to snow in Sterich."
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 21, 2010
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    Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:51 pm  

    Thanks for the replies so far! I like that weather generator but there are few things that don't appeal to me. Like having -15 celsius during winters (at lowest) and maybe not a enough daylite. Personally I'd like to keep the absolute minimum temperature for a year at -5 degrees and days would be 11 - 16 hours long. But these are just my opinions. However, that weather generator will be very useful in my games and I thank thee!
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
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    Mon Dec 05, 2011 6:10 am  

    smillan_31 wrote:
    "Well, Sterich is a big valley almost entirely surrounded by mountains and hills with it's main river being shallow, very cold and swiftly running, so feel free to just say it's at a higher elevation if you want it to snow in Sterich."


    That's an almost perfect description of Grand Junction, Colorado -- where I spent 20 years of my life.

    The surrounding area is usually buried in snow -- there are ski resorts there -- but the valley itself doesn't get a great deal of it, though it certainly gets some snow.

    Grand Junction is second -- in the U.S. -- only to San Francisco in "Constant year 'round temperature." They advertise that fact heavily and many of California's retirees are moving there -- I know, I built houses for them. Wink

    So, in Sterich . . . ? Confused
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    Paladin

    Joined: Sep 07, 2011
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    Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:04 am  

    Sutemi wrote:
    Thanks for the replies so far! I like that weather generator but there are few things that don't appeal to me. Like having -15 celsius during winters (at lowest) and maybe not a enough daylite. Personally I'd like to keep the absolute minimum temperature for a year at -5 degrees and days would be 11 - 16 hours long. But these are just my opinions. However, that weather generator will be very useful in my games and I thank thee!

    Sutemi,
    I can see your concerns, and as others and I have discussed in other postings, some DMs prefer to have more control over weather events within their campaigns. With that, I have been in process of modifying that particular spreadsheet and incorporating it with a calendar and Glossography for another project I have in the works for a different thread. Should have a post on it with in a couple of weeks (if / when moderators approve on their review)
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:00 pm  

    Hello again,

    If memory serves me correctly, there is a quick and easy weather reference chart (cardstock?) in either "From the Ashes" or "City of Greyhawk" boxed sets but it is not nearly as in depth as the information found in the original "World of Greyhawk" edition.

    Furthermore, some later 2e (?) supplements came out of some use with weather generation. "The Adventure Begins" booklet has some information that I found interesting (esp. pertaining to the Domain of Greyhawk and surrounding areas, including the Wild Coast), and the thinner "Greyhawk: Player's Guide" likewise has information on weather and climate, too.

    -Lanthorn
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:10 am  

    To avoid creating a new thread, I'll post this here:

    I was thinking of winter/arctic campaigning.

    The only source I remember which discussed dog sleds was the Wilderness Survival Guide (AD&D1). Anything else?

    I don't remember anything on cross-country skiing either, even in articles dedicated to snow/winter/arctic/etc issues, which is strange, since skiing goes back to the bronze age. One would think that the Frost, Snow, Ice and Barbarians, natives of the Burneal Forest, the land of Black Ice, and (maybe) Ratik and Blackmoor would use it.
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:35 pm  

    The Wilderness Survival Guide is hard to beat, in my opinion, when it comes to running outdoor campaigns.

    It is true that this great tome covers dogsled travel, among other methods of locomotion (beast, vehicle, or by person), but I don't recall anything on using snowshoes, etc.

    -Lanthorn
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:02 pm  

    Lanthorn wrote:
    The Wilderness Survival Guide is hard to beat, in my opinion, when it comes to running outdoor campaigns.

    It is true that this great tome covers dogsled travel, among other methods of locomotion (beast, vehicle, or by person), but I don't recall anything on using snowshoes, etc.

    -Lanthorn


    Aargh! I forgot about snowshoes! Laughing
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
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    Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:34 am  

    Wink

    You could also use reindeer as beasts of burden in your campaign, especially if they are pulling loads and vehicles. I could surely see some of the Suel northern barbarians using them, just as the Scandinavians have done.

    In the northern seas, ships/boats could work, fashioned of wood, bone, and hides (or cloth, if available). The main threat (aside from critters) would be icebergs and floes smashing them to bits or tearing open their hulls, but it is possible. The Norsemen were excellent sea-farers, after all.

    -Lanthorn
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    From: Rel Astra

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    Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:53 pm  

    I see no one has mentioned that there are great weather tables in "The Adventure Begins," 2nd Edition ruleset.
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