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Canonfire :: View topic - Is It Just Me, Or Does Keoland Always Lose?
Is It Just Me, Or Does Keoland Always Lose?

 
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CruelSummerLord
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Joined: Apr 26, 2002
Posts: 321
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PostPosted: Sat May 19, 2018 6:04 pm    Post subject: Is It Just Me, Or Does Keoland Always Lose? Reply with quote

Is it just me, or does Keoland really, really suck at fighting wars?

They've been defeated by most of the other countries of the Sheldomar Valley and beyond:

-Invasion of Geoff: Lost, when Keoland was defeated at the Battle of Gorna. Geoff became confident that it would never again be attacked by Keoland.

-Short War: Lost, when Furyondy and Veluna took Keoland to the woodshed and confiscated Bissel to boot.

-Invasion of Ket: Initially won, but later lost in ensuing decades, to the extent that Ket became a truly independent nation for the first time.

-Ulek Rebellion: Lost, when the Ulekians made themselves independent. What's really pathetic about this one is that Keoland was defeated by the County of Ulek, one of the weakest military powers in the entire Flanaess, and by the Duchy of Ulek, which wasn't that much better.

-Siege of Westkeep: Lost, to the extent that Tavish III is in the running for one of the worst military leaders in the history of the Flanaess. For some bizarre reason, he thought it was a good idea to lead an army of heavily mailed soldiers and a fully equipped wagon train through the Hool Marshes, so that many of his men lost their armor and the wagons were often bogged down. And then, when he finally arrives at Westkeep, Tavish's siege lasts a mere 70 minutes before he gets his fool self killed.

What makes this arguably the nadir of Keoland's defeats is that they lost a siege to pirates, who are far more proficient at fighting on water than on land. The Sea Princes had the best navy in the Flanaess, bar none, but their land forces aren't exactly the Overking's Companion Guard.

Yes, Keoland did confederate the Sheldomar Valley under Tavish I, but we should remember that he did that with the pen, rather than the sword. When Keoland tries to use the sword, it usually tends to stab itself in the foot.

Hence the old saying that going to war without Keoland is like going to war without a pipe organ. They both make a lot of noise and they're both a lot of dead weight, so what's the point in taking them?
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LordGosumba
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PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2018 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The answer is Yes lol!!!

In my campaign, going back a long way; Keoland even lost in a land war with the Sea Princes, who were allied with the Giants from the G series. Didn't go well for them for a few years...
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rasgon
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Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2018 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you take the long view of history, everyone loses eventually. Keoland went through an imperial phase that ended after the country overextended itself and lost critical allies, but it's currently stronger than it's been in some time, having re-added Westkeep to its territory. The recent liberations of Sterich and Geoff with the assistance of Keoish forces could be considered significant victories.

If you believe Samwise's timeline, the war between Keoland and the Sea Princes was actually a civil war between two branches of the House of Rhola, so both sides were in a sense "Keoland."
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vestcoat
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Joined: Jul 29, 2006
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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I disagree with the OP. Keoland is oldest, most successful empire in the Flanaess. They conquered everything they could without open warfare against the GK, Celene, or the far west. Former vassals are either allies or still loosely controlled. No close neighbors pose a serious threat. Lost territories were probably indefensible in the long term anyway.

The average lifespan of an empire is 250 years. Keoland has lasted over 900. Ulek didn't even join until 292CY; its inclusion is barely a hiccup in Keoland's timeline. They "defeated" Keoland, but it would have been political and strategic suicide to press the matter and slaughter friendly demihumans with a mountain range full of bloodthirsty humanoids behind them (this was shortly before the Hateful Wars).

No one holds Bissel for long. The Hool Marshes are a severe natural barrier for a distant monarch to control the Sea Princes.
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mortellan
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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enjoyable topic lol.
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