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    Canonfire :: View topic - Adventure Idea - Land Clearing
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    Adventure Idea - Land Clearing
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    Encyclopedia Greyhawkaniac

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    Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:33 am  
    Adventure Idea - Land Clearing



    Adventure Idea - Land Clearing

    The Adventurers are hired to clear an area of land northwest of Safeton (See Red Dot on Map). Once cleared of dangerous monsters and creatures the Players will be asked to stay on and help protect the workers who are building a walled estate. This is especially important to the man hiring them, Septum Bon, a supposedly wealthy merchant.

    Septum is actually a former pirate and quite successful. He now runs merchant ships from Safeton but wants a more private estate than those available in the small city.

    The area he has chosen contains a small cave complex containing a Troll lair. A hidden entrance in the lair leads to a small hill nearby where a watchtower built by the Suel Imperium once stood. The tower is long gone and even the fallen stones have long since been carted away and used for walls and foundations in Safeton. A secret trap door at the base of the tower was never discovered and the basement levels that hollowed out the hill remain. This hill is haunted by the undead remnants of the Suel guardsmen who hid and died here when their tower was overthrown.

    Several wild animals are in this area, including bears, dire wolves, giant badgers and a lone jackelwere. A large clutch of Owlbears is moving into the north of this area because of forces pushing them out of the Gnarley Forest.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:44 pm  

    It's your game, do what you want... but IIRC the Suel Imperium didn't reach out anywhere NEAR that far in Canon. It might barely be possible in the Sea Princes, especially down along that thin strip of coast between the Hellfurnaces and Jerklea Bay. And the Sea Princes themselves are mostly just a generation or two away from their pirate ancestors themselves.

    More likely in that location would be an old outpost of the Great Kingdom at it's maximum size (it used to include Furyondy and Veluna, not hard to imagine an outpost a bit farther south), something left over from Vecna's kingdom, or even an old ur-Flan stone circle and temple buried under millennia of debris.

    If you're determined to make it Suel, then perhaps a small group tried to settle - and conquer - the area in the immediate post-Cataclysm period and got swamped by humanoids out of the Wild Coast and picked off by the Grey Elves of Celene who didn't appreciate their intrusion into the Welkwood.

    Other than that nitpick, the idea is sound. Even in 'modern' times in Greyhawk humanoid raids and monster attacks remain common on the Wild Coast.

    According to the Anna maps (https://www.annabmeyer.com/greyhawk-maps/online-map-1/) you're into an area of low hills solidly within the area claimed by Safeton, but not far from the lands claimed by Narwell, and well off the main roads in the area. Thus, it's likely to be poorly patrolled and thus infested with hostile critters.

    The possibility for political intrigue is there as well, Narwell might be interested in wooing a new player in the area... If your players are interested in such things, it'll make a nice change of pace for them as well.
    Encyclopedia Greyhawkaniac

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    Thu Aug 12, 2021 5:42 am  

    Vulcan wrote:
    It's your game, do what you want... but IIRC the Suel Imperium didn't reach out anywhere NEAR that far in Canon. It might barely be possible in the Sea Princes, especially down along that thin strip of coast between the Hellfurnaces and Jerklea Bay. And the Sea Princes themselves are mostly just a generation or two away from their pirate ancestors themselves.

    More likely in that location would be an old outpost of the Great Kingdom at it's maximum size (it used to include Furyondy and Veluna, not hard to imagine an outpost a bit farther south), something left over from Vecna's kingdom, or even an old ur-Flan stone circle and temple buried under millennia of debris.

    If you're determined to make it Suel, then perhaps a small group tried to settle - and conquer - the area in the immediate post-Cataclysm period and got swamped by humanoids out of the Wild Coast and picked off by the Grey Elves of Celene who didn't appreciate their intrusion into the Welkwood.

    Other than that nitpick, the idea is sound. Even in 'modern' times in Greyhawk humanoid raids and monster attacks remain common on the Wild Coast.

    According to the Anna maps (https://www.annabmeyer.com/greyhawk-maps/online-map-1/) you're into an area of low hills solidly within the area claimed by Safeton, but not far from the lands claimed by Narwell, and well off the main roads in the area. Thus, it's likely to be poorly patrolled and thus infested with hostile critters.

    The possibility for political intrigue is there as well, Narwell might be interested in wooing a new player in the area... If your players are interested in such things, it'll make a nice change of pace for them as well.


    There is an entire Lost City of the Suel in the northern Suss forest so that according to published material the Suel were very active in the area.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:03 am  

    JasonZavoda wrote:
    ...There is an entire Lost City of the Suel in the northern Suss forest so that according to published material the Suel were very active in the area.


    -I don't remember the city's age from Artifact of Evil. Maybe post-Imperium? If older, it would probably have been an outpost, which could reasonably put it beyond the normal borders of the Imperium.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Thu Aug 12, 2021 10:56 pm  

    I had forgotten about that in the original box set. Embarassed

    A bit of online search turned up this thread at Dragonfoot:https://www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=68489

    and Greyhawk Wiki has this article on it. https://greyhawk.fandom.com/wiki/Lost_City_of_the_Suloise

    According to Greyhawk Wiki it is, indeed, a settlement from after the Invoked Devastation that was lost. But the bit from Gygax's Gord the Rogue novels (via Dragonsfoot) implies the refugee Suel might have found and inhabited far older ruins. OR perhaps not, there might be multiple lost cities in the Suess Forest and Welkwood.... and the players can have all sorts of fun figuring out if the one THEY find is the right one!
    Adept Greytalker

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    Sun Aug 29, 2021 9:53 pm  

    I never thought the Suel Imperium extended into the Flanaess proper. If it did, then I doubt there would have been as much conflict in the Sheldomar Valley when the Suel refugees fled through the Passage of Slerotin. Surely Suel expansion attempts would have led them to battle Flan nations who were still pretty solidly based with their own magical and military prowess, wouldn't they?

    The Crystalmists and Hellfurnaces make for a pretty solid barrier to expansion. Even today, most of the mountain ranges in the Flanaess are unclaimed 'no man's lands'. And wouldn't the Rain of Colorless Fire have poured into the Sheldomar or elsewhere if it was formally part of the Suel Imperium?

    As I see it, the Suel Imperium was entirely confined to the basin that's surrounded by the mountains shown on the expanded map in the 1983 Glossography. It didn't have much in the way of a nautical tradition, since again landlocked countries surrounded by mountains aren't conducive to it.

    Part of the massive cultural changes the Suel experienced during the Twin Cataclysms and the Great Migrations was how many of them changed which gods they honored. Gods like Kord, Llerg and Xerbo only became prominent in the Suel pantheon after the Imperium was destroyed as so many Suel violently rejected their old culture, which favored gods like Beltar, Syrul and Pyremius.
    Encyclopedia Greyhawkaniac

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    Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:13 am  

    CruelSummerLord wrote:
    I never thought the Suel Imperium extended into the Flanaess proper. If it did, then I doubt there would have been as much conflict in the Sheldomar Valley when the Suel refugees fled through the Passage of Slerotin. Surely Suel expansion attempts would have led them to battle Flan nations who were still pretty solidly based with their own magical and military prowess, wouldn't they?

    The Crystalmists and Hellfurnaces make for a pretty solid barrier to expansion. Even today, most of the mountain ranges in the Flanaess are unclaimed 'no man's lands'. And wouldn't the Rain of Colorless Fire have poured into the Sheldomar or elsewhere if it was formally part of the Suel Imperium?

    As I see it, the Suel Imperium was entirely confined to the basin that's surrounded by the mountains shown on the expanded map in the 1983 Glossography. It didn't have much in the way of a nautical tradition, since again landlocked countries surrounded by mountains aren't conducive to it.

    Part of the massive cultural changes the Suel experienced during the Twin Cataclysms and the Great Migrations was how many of them changed which gods they honored. Gods like Kord, Llerg and Xerbo only became prominent in the Suel pantheon after the Imperium was destroyed as so many Suel violently rejected their old culture, which favored gods like Beltar, Syrul and Pyremius.


    I don't understand your point to this post? There is a the lost city of the suel in the Suss? If the Suel were confined to the Sea of Dust how did they come in conflict with the Baklunish? Would mountains be able to prevent the Suel Imperium from building outposts in the Flanaess? If you dont like the post I'd prefer you left off the commentary.
    Adept Greytalker

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    Mon Aug 30, 2021 4:21 pm  

    JasonZavoda wrote:


    I don't understand your point to this post? There is a the lost city of the suel in the Suss? If the Suel were confined to the Sea of Dust how did they come in conflict with the Baklunish? Would mountains be able to prevent the Suel Imperium from building outposts in the Flanaess? If you dont like the post I'd prefer you left off the commentary.


    I apologize if I disrupted the post with my commentary. My intent was to speak along the same lines as Vulcan, namely that I don't think there was much Suel settlement in the Flanaess. It's far more likely IMO that the lost city in the Suss Forest is, as the Greyhawk Wiki posits, a post-Migrations settlement, probably as part of a pre-Aerdy kingdom like the Kingdom of Zelrad that was later conquered and became modern Idee.

    As for the mountains, the Sulhauts don't seem as impassive as the Crystalmists or Hellfurnaces on the Darlene map, so I have an easier time believing that they fought in and through them. If the eastern mountains were easier to cross, then I doubt mages like Slerotin would have needed to create their passages and gates under the mountains.
    Black Hand of Oblivion

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    Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:52 am  

    People thought the cealocanth was extinct for millions of years...until a fisherman caught one.

    People thought there were no Suel in the old Flanaess...until somebody stumbled upon the Lost City in the Suss and returned to tell the tale.

    The folio mentions the lost city in the Suss Forest, and the Gord books do mention something similar. It takes some time to find it, as the ancient map Gord & friends have shows a river (the Jewel very likely, which is no small river) that they discover has, over an immensely long period of time, changed course, such that the terrain no loner matches their map. The location is not likely hundreds of years old, but maybe a thousand or more years old - Suel Imperium era old.

    Greyhawk has a few problems with things termed "ancient," when they are barely 1,000 years old. Remember, gray elves live to be 2,000 years old. Something only around a 1,000 years old is hardly ancient to such folk who could have contemporary knowledge of it. We mere humans don't even consider the history of the 11th century as being "ancient" history. We go back a few thousand years more, and then we start to toss around the word "ancient."

    Excellent adventure concept by the way, Jason. Could be as small or as big as one wants it to be, and has all the seeds to build an adventure in the classic supermodule style.
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    GreySage

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    Wed Sep 01, 2021 9:16 am  

    My best guess from the description in Artifact of Evil is that the Lost City of the Suel in the Suss is a pre-Suel, pre-Flan, probably pre-human ruin the migrations-era Suel built over and occupied for a time before being destroyed by the evil locked within. Assuming the Suel have any connection to it at all.

    Quote:
    This is not Suel workmanship," Gellor remarked as he studied the bas relief carvings on the walls revealed by the ruddy firelight... Legend had said a city of the Suloise had been here, but this place was surely of origination predating the migration of the Invoked Devastation by centuries... It bore no resemblance to any Flan work he had seen, and he said he had seen some of the sacred writings and idols in Tenh.


    For those who use module B4 The Lost City as the Lost City of the Suel, Suloise colonists may have discovered Zargon beneath the ruins, began worshiping him, and ended up evolving into the subterranean Cynidicean civilization.

    That said, there's no reason Imperial-era Suel couldn't have colonies in the Flanaess or other continents, worlds, or planes. It doesn't mean they necessarily ruled any of the land between the colony and the Suel basin proper, or that the colony was recognized or even known about by the imperial government, just that it's not so unlikely for individual Suel to gather the resources to set up colonies on their own.

    The Suel do have two or three gods of the sea, so I do think they likely extended their empire at its height to the ocean and beyond, most likely via the southern "Zindian" coast. On the other hand, the Suel pantheon was known and worshiped on multiple parallel worlds in Lakofka's campaign and not just reflective of the Suel.

    This is beside the point, but I'll add that rivers can shift their course very suddenly. A river near where I live went over its banks and, all at once, cut a more direct channel about a century ago, turning the long bend where it formerly flowed into an oxbow lake. The marshy land where the Lost City is might well be an oxbow formed in relatively recent years. Though the city itself is likely far older than Gord's map.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Thu Sep 02, 2021 10:55 am  

    rasgon wrote:
    ...That said, there's no reason Imperial-era Suel couldn't have colonies in the Flanaess or other continents, worlds, or planes. It doesn't mean they necessarily ruled any of the land between the colony and the Suel basin proper, or that the colony was recognized or even known about by the imperial government, just that it's not so unlikely for individual Suel to gather the resources to set up colonies on their own... The Suel do have two or three gods of the sea, so I do think they likely extended their empire at its height to the ocean and beyond


    -I was going for "outpost".

    rasgon wrote:
    ...This is beside the point, but I'll add that rivers can shift their course very suddenly. A river near where I live went over its banks and, all at once, cut a more direct channel about a century ago, turning the long bend where it formerly flowed into an oxbow lake...


    An example:
    https://www.thevintagenews.com/2016/06/12/steamboat-arabia-missing-for-132-years-discovered-45-feet-under-a-field/
    Adventure idea: The mule became undead. Laughing

    A less extreme example, on the Flanaess' tech' level:
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4462138/Restoration-team-building-exact-replica-medieval-boat.html
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