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    Canonfire :: View topic - Elven/Olve (& dwur) perspective on history in the Flanae
    Canonfire Forum Index -> World of Greyhawk Discussion
    Elven/Olve (& dwur) perspective on history in the Flanae
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    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Feb 13, 2020
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    From: Emigre from Mystara

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    Wed Nov 08, 2023 8:32 pm  
    Elven/Olve (& dwur) perspective on history in the Flanae

    Samwise posted this useful perspective on Discord just now:
    In terms of history, the Twin Cataclysms occurred in -422 CY. A mature Gray Olv who was 251 years old at the time, the equivalent of a 21-year-old Human, would be 1,249 years old in 576 CY, about the same as a 76-year-old Human, and almost certainly still alive. Even some Sylvan Olve, while at the high end of their caste, are still alive from that time. These Olve have lived through the entire era since the Oeridians and Suloise entered the Flanaess. Younger Olve have likewise experienced a great deal. A High Olv who was 176 years old, again the equivalent of a 21-year-old Human, when the Overking was crowned is now 782 years old and still middle-aged, similar to a 50-year-old Human. A child of this Olv could have come of age as Nyrond established its independence and before the Turmoil Between Crowns began, or while Keoland was at its peak, perhaps just after Celene repudiated its treaties and expelled the royal garrisons. A youthful Olven rogue, the equivalent of a Human teen, would have grown up as humanoids overran the Bone March and Pomarj and while Iuz first threatened Furyondy before being imprisoned. Unlike Humans who might have to scour old tomes even to know of these events, or perhaps heard tales from an elder concerning the most recent ones, they are part of the immediate experiences of an Olv.
    Middle-aged Dwurrow lived and fought through the Turmoil Between Crowns and the formation of the Iron League.
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Sep 16, 2006
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    From: Durnagald

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    Wed Nov 08, 2023 8:34 pm  

    Great post - really puts things into "perspective"
    Adept Greytalker

    Joined: Apr 11, 2009
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    From: Verbobonc

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    Thu Nov 09, 2023 5:47 am  

    Ray Dalio's book, Principals talks about the fact that there is an economic cycle of about 120 years, with smaller nested cycles. The reason things always seem to surprise people is that even if we live to 80, we only have about 60 years of experience, if we are paying attention. Thus, while a few people born during the Great Depression are still alive, they have no meaningful memory of it, and would not recognize the trends leading to it. How would this work with our very long-lived demi-humans? Would they look at human history as a series of endlessly repeating cycles from which humans are unable to escape?

    Another interesting aspect on this is nostalgia. Most people think of their childhoods and youth as having been wonderful times, and the present as being a somewhat fallen place, despite objective reality being different. One person described this as the fact that when you are young, you are not thinking about crime, debt, finding a job, etc., but when you are older, these burdens weigh upon you and we remember our youths as carefree. Would demi-humans romanticize a past for the same or similar reasons, but on a grander scale, "it has all been downhill since the Great Migrations"?


    Last edited by tarelton on Sun Nov 26, 2023 6:13 pm; edited 2 times in total
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jun 16, 2003
    Posts: 201
    From: Calgary, AB, Canada

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    Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:48 pm  

    What timing!

    I was just thinking about this very subject last night, while preparing a player primer to the Salinmoor/Dreadwood area, and before seeing this thread!
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